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Noob question on module connection

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Im familiar with pcb kit building and will be able to assemble my parts fine but ive got a few midibox platform questions

Ive ordered 2 core8 pcbs, 2 midibox sid pcbs, and a midibox genesis pcb.

Is it best to use the two sids with a core8 and the genesis with the other core8? Or is there a way to use all the modules with the same core? Ive done some research and cant find any evidence of the sid pcb supporting more than one sid, so im assuming that unless its the mb-6582 its one sid per sid-pcb. Im aware the mb-6582 uses a more expensive pic device, not sure if i would need this for multiple sids with the modules I've got

My aim is to be able to construct a device that can be used as a synthesizer, running as a slave synced to a daw running on my computer, are there any additional modules i'll need for this?

Thanks for being patient if these questions turn out to be really common, i did check first but it wasnt as clear-cut as i was hoping

 

 

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You can run two sids per core8 to get stereo and chain up to 4 core8 for 8 sids. One sid per sid module. I would also build at least one bank stick you can do it on vero board for patches and I would get an LCD and a din in X4 for the minimum control surface or you can also build a din in x2 on vero board pretty easily. The din in x4 would be better as you could choose a few more buttons or knobs to add. I may be wrong but I believe the genesis synth is still a work in progress and not a full synth and it needs a core32 not a core 8.  I would recommend building a dual swin sid to run on your second core. I like the sound of it a lot and that would let you run two different stereo sid engines say a bass line engine and a lead engine at the same time. It would give you a lot more flexibility.

 

check this post for more details:

http://midibox.org/forums/topic/20921-n00b-question-before-etching/#comment-182490

 

Note you can use the nano swin boards that are floating around and put those "sid chips" in sid modules (be sure to build as 5v sid modules) but the board I posted here is a lot easier to solder up (through hole only) and it will take up much less space if that is a concern.

 

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Hey thanks for replying

I will order two new sid modules and go with 4 sids like you suggested. I agree that using two sids and two 'emulated' sids sounds cool and im going with 8580 sids because I had a C64Cwith 8580s as a child. I have heard that they run slower though?

Im still a little confused about modules. Do I have all I need to use the sids as a synth once ive ordered and assembled all the pcbs? (obviously in a shoebox, panels etc comes later). Im aware there are midi in/out modules, and the demos online appear to have reverb/delay so I wondered if its possible to add an extra module for that. My intention is to use the synth with a DAW supplying a timer over midi (im a renoise guy) rather than a hardware sequencer.

For the genesis module im still a little bit confused about the state that it is at at the moment. Is it a useless pcb currently or is it awaiting a firmware update? I tried looking online but all the information I found was for quad genesis builds

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It's really necessary to read all the stuff online, also it's annoying. So take some time and do research.

-They run slower as ...? (Never heard of it, they sound cleaner than 6581 and have a better "working" filter. Also they are a bit younger and so will live a bit longer than 6581s.

-You have 2 Cores and 4 SIDs. The Master Core is your Mainboard. It delievers Midi and connections to LCD and other modules.

If you have built and connected this stuff you have a SID Synthesizer which can be controlled via midi (sysex/cc)  https://ctrlr.org/midibox-sid-v2/

thats all. As far as I know changing the SID and saving patches doesn't work without a Control surface.

If you want to edit your SIDs without midi, you need to build a so called minimal CS with LCD and you need to built at minimum 2 DINX, (a half dinx 4 module which is sold out at mo addict). If you want some LEDs, you need the doutx module.

-for reverb and delay you should built or buy some guitar fx pedals or whatever, it's nothing midibox related.

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3 minutes ago, Noise-Generator said:

It's really necessary to read all the stuff online, also it's annoying. So take some time and do research.

-They run slower as ...? (Never heard of it, they sound cleaner than 6581 and have a better "working" filter. Also they are a bit younger and so will live a bit longer than 6581s.

-You have 2 Cores and 4 SIDs. The Master Core is your Mainboard. It delievers Midi and connections to LCD and other modules.

If you have built and connected this stuff you have a SID Synthesizer which can be controlled via midi (sysex/cc)  https://ctrlr.org/midibox-sid-v2/

thats all. As far as I know changing the SID and saving patches doesn't work without a Control surface.

If you want to edit your SIDs without midi, you need to build a so called minimal CS with LCD and you need to built at minimum 2 DINX, (a half dinx 4 module which is sold out at mo addict). If you want some LEDs, you need the doutx module.

-for reverb and delay you should built or buy some guitar fx pedals or whatever, it's nothing midibox related.

I get it now, thanks

I do plan on building the control surface. I plan to use the plexiglass C64 case (empty) from https://www.plexilaser.de/ modified into a midibox sid.

Final question though: for power, my research shows that the C64 psu used to be recommended but is now no longer recommended. So should I not buy a 'modern' c64 psu from ebay? Would something like this work https://uk.rs-online.com/web/p/products/0413605

Power supplies are where i am the least skilled

Thanks

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You need 5v to power the cores

You need 9 (and or 12v) for the sids

The C64 psu is not recommend anymore because they are old and can burn your sid -or just die.

If you buy a new one than this is not the case but they are big and expensive.

I use this and can't say any thing bad atm about it https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/12V-2A-5V-2A-Mains-AC-Adaptor-Power-Supply-Unit-for-Iomega-MDHD500-TE-Hard-Drive/401392329621?hash=item5d74d8e395:g:BHYAAOSwuQxaYth~

It delievers 12 and 5v so you just need to convert the 12 to 9v for the 8580.

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Swin sid is all 5v and you do not have to worry about letting the magic smoke out on a first time build as much as with a sid chip. Good working sid chips have gotten quite pricy the last few years.  I bet you already have a 5v regulated ac adapter too if you check you cell phone adapters.

Be sure to use the 9v regulator for the 8580 and test all the voltages before putting you sid and pic in.  Everything is built in on the 8 bit core for the sid except the din in and out for buttons and leds. You will want an eprom for storing patches too but do not need one to get started. 

I highly recommend you build the minimum control surface with the buttons, screen and encoder. You will be able to access all the functions from there and if you have to trouble shoot anything it will be easier to see that it is turning on and booting properly. You should be able to build it on vero board for $10.

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3 hours ago, gerald.wert said:

Swin sid is all 5v

9 or 12v doesn't matter because behavior is done by jumpers. Are you sure they work with 5 or did you mean 12?

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On 11/11/2019 at 7:20 PM, gerald.wert said:

Swin sid is all 5v and you do not have to worry about letting the magic smoke out on a first time build as much as with a sid chip. Good working sid chips have gotten quite pricy the last few years.

The plan is to use swinsids first now (x2) and add two 8580 sids after

On 11/11/2019 at 7:20 PM, gerald.wert said:

I highly recommend you build the minimum control surface with the buttons, screen and encoder. You will be able to access all the functions from there and if you have to trouble shoot anything it will be easier to see that it is turning on and booting properly. You should be able to build it on vero board for $10.

I shall be building the control surface in a cardboard box lid first and having one printed using the front panel designer file on acyrlic instead of metal

Do you know if the sids need to be cooled? As i understand it the oldest sids ran hottest. 8580 and swin sid should be fine right? Also read that fan cooling is discouraged because of noise

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a fan is definitely pretty audible, I have passive heatsinks on my 8580s and when I asked whether I really needed the fans the general advice was "definitely not", so mine is now unplugged and just there for decorative purposes. Despite the synth being encased in foam in a flight case at the moment, no issues. 
I don't know about SwinSID though....

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The one I linked to does not get hot. Some of the pin compatible ones the regulator on them may get hot but it should be accounted for in the design. Note some of the pin compatible ones may need 9 or 12v and not just 5v you will have to check to see what it needs. It all depends on what you end up.  You will want to load the siwin sid firmware on the pic. It gives a few extra wave forms with it and it is possible to add a few more if you know how to program, that is beyond my programming ability though.

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I guess I understand now what you mean but you should explain why.

If we are talking about SwinSIDs as a SID replacement than we speak about already built ones which you can just plug and play inside the SID modules... but yes, a SwinSID is just an Atmega Uc with some added circuits and if you could built it on your own and connect it to the Core, than you might don't need 9V...or do they work at 5V and are just compatible with higher Voltages? 

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