Want to build a LCD like Steinberg Houston one for Cubase

[lagoausente]

  I´m thinking about building a portable pc, with a mini-itx mainboard. I would like to add a LCD to avoid a tft (for the moment). Using Steinberg Houston can select tracks, rec arm, and transport, and see on the lcd on with track I´m.  Can you give a first guide how could be?

  Thanks, a lot. This site is very interesting.

[pay_c]

Perhaps some serial LCD? They can be connected directly to thee RS-232 port and can be controled like a normal keyboard. You just send the appropiate letters (e.g. "blablabla... Line Feed"). Would be the easiest solution, I think. Those displays are also often used for PC-modding (they display temperatures or frequencies there).

Greetz.

[lagoausente]

:) 

Well, I starting to understand someting about MiOS, but still have a lot of dubts.

 

I have found that the Doepfer pocket fader I had on an corner (since bough the Houston), has the PIC 16F73. Well, if I understood ok, first Midiboxes worked with a 16f pci, I´m ok?

well, if ôm going right, Mios could be loaded into that PIC?, If yes, also the Cubase Steinberg Houston emulation on this web could be loaded also? (perhaps I´m been to much optimist).

Well, the Doepfer has midi in and out, so, my mind is thinking maybe I can use this midi in to load the Mios??

And convert the Doepfer into a little Steinberg Houston??,  than, add an LCD like Houston one?

Of course, I only would need a litlle functions of the Houston. I just want some faders, trasnsport (rec, play, stop), and the lcd display, (which track I m, etc)

  If have understanding ok, this would be posible, and would be avoiding to build a PCB, buy faders etc.

And the last cuestion; could be replaced the 16f73 por a newer chip there?

  I´ll thank a lot your patiente with me. I´m totally newbie.  ???

[raphael]

I have found that the Doepfer pocket fader I had on an corner (since bough the Houston), has the PIC 16F73. Well, if I understood ok, first Midiboxes worked with a 16f pci, I´m ok?

well, if ôm going right, Mios could be loaded into that PIC?

No, MIOS is developed for the 18F PIC. Older Midiboxes (16F877) don't use MIOS.

16F73 isn't even compatible with the 16F877 and has only half of it's memory... no chance for MIOS.

And the last cuestion; could be replaced the 16f73 por a newer chip there?

Never seen a pocket fader from inside. But from your questions I assume that you have no good knowledge in electronics, right? So easiest way would be to build your own MidiBox core module, I think.

[lagoausente]

  Well, if I understood ok, if I buy a Core Module, with Mios installed, I´ll be avaible to load the Houston emulation through the miid input pin? with Mios Studio? I´m correct?

Then, sold the correct lcd into the correct pins, and I´ll have something like Houston LCD?

[raphael]

Well, if I understood ok, if I buy a Core Module, with Mios installed, I´ll be avaible to load the Houston emulation through the miid input pin? with Mios Studio? I´m correct?

Almost. You have to upload MIOS first, than the application. The PIC comes only with the bootloader.

You should read the bootstrap page carefully: http://www.ucapps.de/mios_bootstrap_newbies.html

Then, sold the correct lcd into the correct pins, and I´ll have something like Houston LCD?

The houston emulation only supports 2 x 40 display.

The original Houston uses a custom LCD that has a space after every 5 characters. I would use the LC (Mackie Control) emulation with 2 2x40 LCDs.

Raphael

[Jidis]

Not sure if it's simpler or more complex ;D, but there's a bunch of single board computers out there with built-in LCD interfaces, which can connect to many of the standard laptop style (digital input) screens. There's those "weirdo" SBC's which mount in a chassis with others, and then there's one's which are basically an ATX board smushed down really small. They've got all the same connectors (plus some), but some of it is on smaller sockets and pin headers.

I grabbed one a while back and had previously found a new 10" monochrome VGA LCD for 9 bucks or something. The screens are pretty worthless because no one can use them without a proprietary digital output. I'll probably end up with something larger when I get around to using it (maybe find a dead laptop). The video circuits are bios selectable for lots of stuff and there's pins for a bunch of output types.

The video is usually a C&T chipset, but I think there's a few others (just look for "LCD connector"). I got a P3 which can get up to around a gig. I think anything more current is too pricey in an SBC. You could find the P3 boards for $50 and below a while back. It's no dualcore Opteron, but it can probably handle decent multitrack junk (it's got ATA133 or 100 busses). There's also a PCI slot for an actual soundcard, which you can put on an angle adapter.

The real "tactile" controls and switches (MIDIBox) are cool as crap, but getting a DAW up and running, opening/saving sessions, etc., without frequent access to the screen might be tricky, unless you're really good with scripts or something. ;)

If you did a minimal LCD for the DAW, you might even be able to do a screenless MIDIbox (assuming they'll be working together). I figure you're talking about putting together a compact portable computer anyway. This way you might not have to deal with the size limits of most LCD's (or the programming and tweaking of a larger one).

Good Luck!

George 

[lagoausente]

  ::)  I really don´t understand how work pci-bus-slot cpu cards. Are the way so have severla pcs into only one case??

I also, don´t find the difference between the mini-itx boards and the SFB ones.

But, I think I would be ok with a mainboard like; DFI G5M100-N Pentium M Mini-ITX  (see here http://www.mini-itx.com/store/?c=2#p1630)

and a 7" tft monitor. I have found 7" touchcreens tft on ebay under 200 Eur, with VGA input and 12V.

All could be mounted in a case, with the other components, and of course, I have forgotten the Midibox emulation. Just a wireless numerical keyboard for transport is enough, what do you think?

[Jidis]

 I really don´t understand how work pci-bus-slot cpu cards. Are the way so have several pcs into only one case??

No, I actually meant to stay away from the ones which go in a mainframe chassis. You'll see contacts along one edge of those, like a PCI/ISA card, and they're usually smaller than a motherboard. I don't think they do any good without the host thing. The one's I was talking about are pretty much regular motherboards with CPU/RAM sockets, usually one PCI slot, a standard ATX power connector, and a multitude of standard i/o connectors crammed into small sockets and pin headers (you just have to make some cable/adapters). The benefit to them over a regular mini-ITX,etc., is that they often have an onboard digital interface for different "laptop-style" LCD output signals, as well as a regular VGA out. The replacement and used laptop LCD parts are pretty worthless for most people, without buying an expensive card to drive them, so they go for really cheap, and as you know, there's a million different sizes and types available (be safe and check the specs with the board's onboard LCD controller). You may even have an old or broken laptop you can get one from.

I have found 7" touchcreens tft on ebay under 200 Eur, with VGA input and 12V.

Be careful with flat panels stating "VGA", etc. I found out the hard way that it really only refers to the resolution (640x480), and has no bearing on the actual input circuitry. That's the reason I have the ten dollar 10" monochrome. It listed as "VGA" and had a fifteen pin connection, so I figured I was good to go on a regular board. It does do 800x600, and it's small, so I may still use it with the SBC. From what I read, there are few, if any, screens which can take standard analog signals from a video card. You'd almost be better off just getting a cheap desktop flat screen and ripping out the screen and the converter circuit.

FWIW, the video chipsets (like C&T) you see on the SBC's aren't supposed to be all that great, but I don't really have a need for "gamer style" graphics. It sounded like they were similar to the Trident's and stuff you find built into lots of budget motherboards. I guess you still have the benefit of getting a direct digital path. The 15 pin desktop screens get converted to and from analog to get from the computer to the panel. It sucks that those chips only show up on SBC's if they're not expensive. If someone would do a cheap PCI card with a digital LCD connection, it would open up a world of DIY opportunities. I thought the same thing about the fixed frequency cards many years ago. There were really nice, giant CRT's around from Mac's and workstations, which nobody could use without buying some ridiculously expensive fixed frequency video card (Sage), which was said to be average or low end quality and/or a "hacked bios" version of a regular cheap card. There should have been more to pick from.

I guess you're on your own with the MB design (depends on what you need). I was just thinking that if you could get a full visual interface to the DAW parameters you were controlling (on a small built-in computer screen), you'd get more info, and be able to cut back on the visual feedback required from the MB. You could also do your MB app edits directly from the same box. If you had good enough macros, MIDI-mapped menu/key commands, and/or batch files set up, you could probably boot directly into your DAW software running a session template, and go straight for the physical MB controls, sort of like a nicer customized version of one of those stand-alone harddisk workstations (Roland VS). You could keep a mouse on it, and a PS2 keyboard handy for emergency use.

Take Care,

George

[lagoausente]

No, I actually meant to stay away from the ones which go in a mainframe chassis. You'll see contacts along one edge of those, like a PCI/ISA card, and they're usually smaller than a motherboard.

Well, if they are a pci to conect to a motherboard.., that is the same than a motherboard with regard to size.  ??? isn´t?

Be careful with flat panels stating "VGA", etc. I found out the hard way that it really only refers to the resolution (640x480), and has no bearing on the actual input circuitry.

I think I´m been, but, take a look, If I´m not wrong, this have VgA input conector to use with a pc;

http://cgi.ebay.es/TFT-LCD-8-Touchscreen-Monitor-mit-FB-NEU-OVP_W0QQitemZ4608833664QQcategoryZ38775QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

Regard to the price, comparing with an lcd from a dead laptop, I think that in the time I should spend on finding the correct mainboard chip/lcd combination, studing specs, even solderind etc, I should better have wining the money on any job, to buy the new itmen. Don´t you agree?

You'd almost be better off just getting a cheap desktop flat screen and ripping out the screen and the converter circuit.

Well, I have a 15" tft, but works with 220V. It´s a Philps 150S4, I have been searching on internet for schematics, but no result. In the other hand, I want my Daw, work with an internal 12V battery, and here, I think that the 15" would consume too much, and would be quite big. And again, the time..., I think again that for the price of a item like this, would save time, and time is money also. The only difference to my mind, is that perhaps, working on a DIY proyect is more funny than working on a factory, but perhaps, working on a factory and buying the thing "done", is more pratical, and would have more time to what really is for, playing and recording. 

[Jidis]

Hey again,

Yes that one does indeed look to be a *real* VGA input. Also a good looking price. I've thought about using the common PlayStation One type portable game displays for stuff too. I've seen people rig them to computers. I think they can take composite or maybe a standard RGB input.

I'd be sure to check for comments or reviews on the web about that touch screen, as well as the USB input part of it. I've read threads of even audio USB control surfaces having drivers which were incompatible with Steinberg's stuff (initially). Also make sure whatever you're running will let you do 640x480. I don't think some things will let you run in that.

Good Luck,

George 

[lagoausente]

  Well, I´m nor sure if you will can find info about this Touchscreen.  I have found other two ones that have just the same buttons, the same size, etc, but, no one has a firm on it, well, I think there are some comercial issues here. I´m speculating, but I think that the known firms that are selling this type of LCDs, over 300 Eur, may have super-production at some times, and maybe use other enterprises tu go out those lcds for less prices but without it´s name, for exemple Lilliput, Xernac etc.

  I think is a good way to go, anyway, because I think are the same products with other look.

Regard to the Usb driver, I think it´s a simple driver to use your finger as a mouse on the Touchscreen, double click etc, and so, will work the same on Steinberg or on any sofware, because is just for the "touch" on windows.

[lagoausente]

and also, ummm.. I´m imaging that DFI mini-itx, running a 1,7 centrino processor, and then.. if I´m not wrong, could be "underclocked", to reserve energy, if you don´t need performance,

or instead,  running at 1.7 if you need it, and perhaps could forget the desktop pc in most cases .

[Therezin]

@Jidis: I think the PSone tft screens use composite or s-video inputs from what I remember of the connections on the console.

@lagoausente: You're correct, you can underclock a pentium-M processor to save energy. In fact, you can make it dynamically underclock itself depending on how much processing power is required at the time.

[Jidis]

Yeah, they were separate ins for the PSOne screen IIRC. There were texts on the web about hooking it up, and it wasn't very complicated. Actually, the third party portable screens became a lot easier to find at one point, if I remember.

-- Just found the instruction page. It is indeed 3 colors, sync and ground. They've also got the pinning for the VGA HD15 adapter:

http://bit-tech.net/article/136/

Just double check that 640x480 limit to be safe on whatever you're planning to run. I haven't had to use that in years (other than when I'm being punished in "safe" mode :-[). I remember lots of stuff that wouldn't even start at that size. Should be able to just set your real screen to that size and see what stuff runs I guess.

Here's some pictures of the ten dollar monochrome (does 800x600)-

It's a Sharp LM64P83L. There were surplus dealers that had a whole bunch of new ones last fall.

Anybody doing that stuff may want to watch out with the casing too. When I did my studio cabinets (isolation boxes for the computers), I had the whole things built and had them set up to hold the motherboards and computer guts on shock mounted brackets for noise reduction, with no actual cases. The ground links were all taken care of properly. Then, people in the rec.audio.pro newsgroup informed me that even in that location, there would be certain EMI/RFI crap floating to and from the machines which was a bad idea for an audio environment. I ended up having to line ALL inside surfaces of the cabinets with grounded aluminum sheet AFTER they were assembled, laying on my back most of the time like a mechanic, with my head and neck up inside the cabs, slicing myself every so often on the sheet material. There were also shock mounted fan frames involved which had to be done with heavy duty foil shapes and aluminum screening grounded to the sheets. All of this would have been a cinch if it happened "pre-assembly". Needless to say, it isn't one of my fondest memories.

Let's be careful out there.

George   

[lagoausente]

  I have found that some models of the Via Epia Mini-itx boards comes with a LVDS conector, the manual tells to can conect to some lcd panels.  Can be conected to any panel? how can I find with panel would work?

[Screaming_Rabbit]

  I have found that some models of the Via Epia Mini-itx boards comes with a LVDS conector, the manual tells to can conect to some lcd panels.  Can be conected to any panel? how can I find with panel would work?

... most Laptops use LVDS connection and those panels you get cheap from surplus resources.

Greets, Roger

[Jack]

Maybe this can be usefull! But it is in German! ;)

http://www.mikrocontroller.net/forum/read-4-160854.html#new

Jack