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SwinSID - a pin compatible alternative to the SID chip


TheFumigator
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Hi TK!

Nice to see you testing the Swin  ;D Do you think it's worth to build the swin as a 1to1 replacement and wait for further updates ?

What do i need to burn the firmware ?

I ask because i'm using a not fully working SId (mentioned in a early thread @german) and before searching eb** i would try the swinsid. It looks promising also without any special functions.

best regards

Christian

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Not got time to try this, but there is some AVR Moog filter code in the latest version of AVRsynth from

http://krue.net/avrsyn/ there are samples on the site. This might be patchable into the SwinSID.

I have the AVRsynth board up and running, but I can't do any panel work until some other stuff is clear, so I haven't done more than a functional test. The filter samples are a lot better than the original AVRsynth filter.

My long term interest in the AVRsynth is to split it into Master/slaves and make a polysynth.

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PonyProg is a very nice program for flashing AVR.

Yes, i will try to add more new features to standard SID emulation instead of pseudo-reverb effect.

I will release new firmware this weekend with following changes:

- Linear Attack support

- Logarithmic Decay and Release

- 2 x oversampling instead of interpolation

- No reverb effect

After some testing from you I will implement a lowpass filter soon.

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While playing high notes with full spectrum waveforms like sawtooth and pulse you can hear some harmonics. , but this is a standard effect with simple wavetable synthesizers.

I am still working to improve sound quality and add new features to SwinSID with help and testing from TK. When I finish we will release music demos and comparisions, so please be patient

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OK, I'll be patient.

Is it ready yet?

Is it ready yet? Is it ready yet?

Is it ready yet? Is it ready yet? Is it ready yet? Is it ready yet?

Is it ready yet? Is it ready yet? Is it ready yet? Is it ready yet? Is it ready yet? Is it ready yet? Is it ready yet? Is it ready yet?

Is it ready yet?

;D

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  • 2 weeks later...
  • 2 weeks later...

Don't worry, development is still in progress; Swinkels sends me a new firmware almost every day!!! :)

I'm sure that you would be frustrated, if you would have build the circuit based on the schematic of two weeks ago, just to notice that it isn't compatible with the future firmware anymore.

I can already bring you down from the illusion, that a 100% accurate SID emulation cannot be expected.

An AVR is not a Pentium, sample rate is low and it is impossible to oversample the sounds often enough to eliminate alias effects. So, for everybody who wants pure SID sound, keep searching for the original...

...and use SwinSID in addition! :)

Main advantages of SwinSID:

  - you will be able to access a wavetable synth with the mighty MBSID V2 engine!

  - no ADSR envelope bug

  - more waveforms

  - Swinkels is planning to add FM and Morphing effects

  - a fat and --> dirty <-- filter!

  - nobody prevents you to add analog circurity in addition!

Since I'm currently more busy with testing SwinSID than writing demo tunes, I'm not able to give you some typical chip effects and tunes which can be realized very easily and which sound very similar to the SID.

Therefore I will just give you an untypical bassline (created with the Lead engine) just to demonstrate how cool the filter sounds since about 3 hours :)

-> http://www.ucapps.de/mp3/swinsid/swinsid_preview1.mp3

Note that this is not a representative demo - SwinSID is not just an "additive synth emulation", the potential is much higher!

Some hardware related info:

please wait before buying the stuff - as mentioned above: specs are not stable yet.

Meanwhile I've switched to a PCM1754, which is a pretty good audio DAC (normaly used in CD players).

I especially like the de-emphasis options, which adds some crunchyness

But this chip has two disadvantages: like the TDA1543 it isn't produced anymore (Farnell and Digi-Key has some in stock see findchips.com), and it's a SMD part. But it shouldn't be too difficult to solder, even for beginners.

So - if you want to support design, please help to find alternative solutions.

Second fact: yes, there will be a PCB. Swinkels just suggested today to use two AVRs instead of one, since it would only cost you 2 EUR more, but would bring so much more...

Of course, everybody who is interested could already join the beta testing process - just build the circuit given at Swinkels homepage. If you are not able to find the TDA1543, search for the PCM1754. The pin mapping and audio output circuit is described in the datasheet.

Another tip: the 24 MHz crystal "24,0000-HC18" from Reichelt cannot be used (it's a 3rd overtone crystal) - just use an integrated oscillator like "OSZI 24,000000" instead.

Please be patient, and don't bring us into pressure - something really cool is growing up, and this needs time! :)

Best Regards, Thorsten.

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Good morning TK!

Nice to see the project growing. There will be no pressure, because most of us are still looking for the original SID.

But i like the idea of an independent SID-like synth. "Cheap", dirt and "lofi" with the advantages of a real synth is just what i want.

best regards

Christian

ps. found some TDA's over @segor.de

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Swinkels, TK, take your time. I don`t believe we are in hurry. I`m sure we already have more projects on "do to" list  than we have time to build it.

Personally I don`t expect exact SID emulation at all, more something new, different. And what swinSID advantages sounds really great. Now that Wilba is selling 6582`s and those nice PCB`s everybody can build one even if no C64 around.

Semo sounds really great, I wish there are few more, but please don`t make it if you don`t feel like. Better spend more time developing.  :) Looking forward to see the fruits of your collaboration.  ;)

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Sounds to me like it's growing into quite a chip project! I wonder when you mention wavetables, could it produces results like the Elba Monowave? If so, that would be awesome! I know that uses a moog style filter rather than a DCF, but I think I'd prefer the nasty aliasing you get from the DCF. There's all manner of smooth sounding synths, who needs another Moog clone ;)

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Another tip: the 24 MHz crystal "24,0000-HC18" from Reichelt cannot be used (it's a 3rd overtone crystal) - just use an integrated oscillator like "OSZI 24,000000" instead.

Ah, that's the point. I built one using this crystal type. I made a test in a c64 and swinsid outputes only random noise. So I have to replace the crystal with the osc... Thanks TK

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  • 3 months later...

*bump*

How goes the SwinSID work? Can't wait for the SwinSID modules :)

Any chance you could post the unassembled code with it, too? I'd be interested in trying a dsPIC version, (16-bit pic, filters, and whatnot), even if just for fun.  ;D

I've got the 16-bit dsPIC tools and such, just need a reason to crack open the box and get'em going  8)

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Hmnnnnn...... I want one, sounds a bit like a 303. Dunno if I want to substitute a couple for some 6582s in my Wilbabeast though, wouldn;t be a MB-6582 then.

I think I may have to build another midibox, which is good. By building the MB-6582 I feel that I'm missing out on learning about the MBHP and how it all fits together.... So quite a few projects now... MB-6582, Mr Midi thingy, MB-FM, Swinsid and something else I'm looking at  ;) Think I may have to cancel some holday at some point.

        G

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By building the MB-6582 I feel that I'm missing out on learning about the MBHP and how it all fits together....

Sorry for the off-topic, but I disagree... they are the same MBHP modules just assembled onto one PCB, and where possible, I've even kept the same part numbers. The PCB makes it smaller, and a bit easier to put together (less wiring, no DIY power supply/BankStick), but you still can and should learn how it fits together by looking at the schematics and wiring diagrams.

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I understand it's the same modules that make up the MB-6582. Don't get me wrong, I'm not against the MB-6882  in any way, I think it's an amazing thing you have done for the community there. I just feel that it will be a greater learning experience for me to learn about building the modules seperately as well, I certainly want to build a set up so I can mix and match, try different things out and learn how they all work. Eventually i'm looking at designing my own midibox so I need to learn about each module in depth, unfortunately the only way I seem to be able to learn and take information in is by doing rather than reading.

      G

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