bugfight Posted October 19, 2007 Author Report Share Posted October 19, 2007 to clarify:protos were $25 each (which is still less than sparkfun, since one of these == 2 of theirs) talking to SmashTV, it sounds like we can get a small run done for under $15 per brd (about half sparkfun price) with ENIG so contacts should be fine without extra effort required.so for example, to make an 8x8 monome like thing (i think i'll call mine "the thing" since that's what SmashTV has been calling it and he's my guru *whack*), you would need two of these brds and 4 button pads from sparkfun. it might be a good idea to combine a bulk order of button pads with the brds.note that this is not a project for beginners, but it was my first SMD work and wasn't too hard. and way easier than it would have been to wire all the dins and douts on other brds. the second brd went quite quickly since i already had the hang of it. people with steadier hands than mine should have no trouble at all. since you must solder chips directly to brd without sockets, an ESD safe soldering iron is highly recommended. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cimo Posted October 19, 2007 Report Share Posted October 19, 2007 this would eliminate the need for debounce and would probably be more durable.who s told you that ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bugfight Posted October 19, 2007 Author Report Share Posted October 19, 2007 who s told you that ?perhaps you misunderstood that sentence, since it is a little off topic. we were talking about other ways to get silicon buttons than the sparkfun ones. quality tact buttons don't need to be debounced.if you are questioning the "more durable" part, it is i guess SmashTV's opinion that the sparkfun buttons may wear out sooner. (Not that the guru has nameized me to speak for him *whack*) i think it is a reasonable opinion, since quality tact buttons are rated for millions of pushes... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cimo Posted October 23, 2007 Report Share Posted October 23, 2007 .. you ve never been pushed by me then ! ;) well i only wanted to underline that i had to debounce so called good quality switches.. yes yes it is you Mr RJS switches i am talking about! but that was my fault to think that expensive=goodjust don t assume you won t have to debounce any tactile switch..simone Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sasha Posted January 11, 2008 Report Share Posted January 11, 2008 As TK made BLM example I wonder what is happening with this project? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bugfight Posted January 11, 2008 Author Report Share Posted January 11, 2008 As TK made BLM example I wonder what is happening with this project?i will try the new example this weekend. the only new features are the debounce(woohoo!) and direct midi control of the leds.i still need to try cool-amp on an unpopulated pcb and/or fix the one i tried tocool-amp after it was populated, but if any more pcbs are made, they shouldhave ENIG which will be much better than cool-amp. but there didn't seem to be so much interest in a run of pcbs... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cimo Posted January 11, 2008 Report Share Posted January 11, 2008 heyJ (and whoever) i ve miserably failed my first PCB for the sparkfun buttons, i have to say i didn t tried it out yet but it looks like a piece of ship (a wrecked one) or like a piece of sheep (a dead one), terrible vias, shortcut pads, badly cut dimensions, a disaster.If that s going to work anyway .. i ll call it a miracle and make myself priesti need to redraw the layout on eagle, move the vias which are on the pads out of there so they won t interfere with the buttons pressure zone.I tried the cool amp thingy (tx smash and jimp) it goes without effort on an unetched board.i ll give it another go, if it doesn t work this way i ll have to ask mr olimex to do the dirty job for me, with a real unpleasant feeling of failure by my side, that s life.updates soon Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bugfight Posted January 11, 2008 Author Report Share Posted January 11, 2008 heyJ (and whoever) i ve miserably failed my first PCB for the sparkfun buttons,...that's a shame.hope it works out in the end. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sasha Posted January 11, 2008 Report Share Posted January 11, 2008 heyJ (and whoever) i ve miserably failed my first PCB for the sparkfun buttons, i have to say i didn t tried it out yet but it looks like a piece of ship (a wrecked one) or like a piece of sheep (a dead one), I feel sorry for you but it is funny how you describe the PCB. ;D ;D ;DI didn`t understand you quite right, but did you fail with your PCB`s or sparkfun`s. Didn`t looked like much difficult to me. What was the problem about it? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cimo Posted January 12, 2008 Report Share Posted January 12, 2008 hii don t (and can t) use sparkfun s pcbs cause i have a 2x8 and 2x5 (you should know that ;) matrices so i etch the damn thing by myself. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bugfight Posted January 12, 2008 Author Report Share Posted January 12, 2008 ahem, so on the subject at hand....new code from tk fully tested. (see this thread http://www.midibox.org/forum/index.php/topic,10476.0.html)cool-amp residue mess cleaned from test subject. (don't try to cool-amp a populated pcb - the residue is conductive and winds up stuck everywhere)with debounce and no hasl in the way, these buttons behave reliably.only time will tell how often they need cleaning, mtbf, etc...next up: mounting method and panel cutting.sparkfun sells a acrylic baffle for this, but it's expensive and i don't like it, so i'm thinking.of cutting my own or just using strips between the buttons to hold the silicon part down.probably will make a frontpanelexpress panel for a "duome", but need to decide if i also want lcd and encoders...it might be a while before i get there, what with all the other stuff i'm into.to be continued.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sasha Posted January 12, 2008 Report Share Posted January 12, 2008 hii don t (and can t) use sparkfun s pcbs cause i have a 2x8 and 2x5 (you should know that Wink matrices so i etch the damn thing by myself.Sure I know your placement on panel but I thought you will cut the sparkfun`s PCBs. I would do that. Sure, you wan`t have all the connecting pads, but could be improvised.Self made PCB contacts oxidate if you don`t coat it somehow. I would never try to make anything like that myself and think it one of those things that really needs to be industrial grade not DIY. Or maybe I`m wrong. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cimo Posted January 12, 2008 Report Share Posted January 12, 2008 i hope to demonstrate that you are wrong, soon. ::)and i ve never thought to do the PCB cutting, it s just a damn good idea. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bugfight Posted January 12, 2008 Author Report Share Posted January 12, 2008 ...Self made PCB contacts oxidate if you don`t coat it somehow. ...pay attention class... this is what the cool-amp does...also note: the pcbs i'm using are manufactured, but HASL is actually worse than bare copper for contacts.i think we can agree the best thing for this purpose is pro pcbs with ENIGbut the cool-amp coated contacts are working great.now if only my buttons weren't "depressed" hehe... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bugfight Posted January 12, 2008 Author Report Share Posted January 12, 2008 ...and i ve never thought to do the PCB cutting, ...we talked about this in the chat, lo those many moons ago...remember, the sparkfun pcbs don't have isolation diodes so they don't workproperly in a matrix, in your case you would want to cut all the matrixtraces and use them as individual buttons. still might be easier than etching your own... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cimo Posted January 14, 2008 Report Share Posted January 14, 2008 :o ;D ;D ;Dit just works !it works perfectly, i haven t noticed any "lost hit" or "double hit" .If that s going to work anyway .. i ll call it a miracle and make myself priestuh oh :-X Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bugfight Posted January 14, 2008 Author Report Share Posted January 14, 2008 it just works !it works perfectly, i haven t noticed any "lost hit" or "double hit" excellent! you didn't enable debounce??try pressing softly and slowly...uh ohthe guru priest! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cimo Posted January 14, 2008 Report Share Posted January 14, 2008 nop no debounce ! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sasha Posted January 14, 2008 Report Share Posted January 14, 2008 That is nice to hear. I need to start writhing down my "to be build" list. I starting to lose myself in all those projects I`m working on, the ones I need to start soon and the ones I didn`t started yet but MUST be built like this BLM trigger. Need to "lock" building order and priorities If I want to finish something soon. :P Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cimo Posted January 16, 2008 Report Share Posted January 16, 2008 hisince i have to do home brew vias, soldering a small cable from top layer to bottom layer i decided to move the vias out of the button pads, here s a preview: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cimo Posted January 19, 2008 Report Share Posted January 19, 2008 sorry but atm only phone camerayou see the vias have been moved out of the buttons pads so they won t interfere, all holes (via, pads,etc) are 0.6mm to help routing the drill bits.The holes for those little pins of the Sparfuns are 3mm (i ve cut off a full line of them, where the pads for the DIL sockets are), holes for the mounting screws are 2.5 mm.Boards etched with PnP Blue (i use a couple of paper sheets under and above the pcbs when ironing to "spread" the pressure evenly, sand with 600 and treat with isopropil), 50% muriatic acid and 50% peroxide 30vol, it etches in about 30 seconds.Finally the board was treated with cool-amp.simone Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gpmacklin Posted January 20, 2008 Report Share Posted January 20, 2008 phone camera photographs are better than no photographs ;D Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Twin-X Posted March 5, 2008 Report Share Posted March 5, 2008 Do you guys use the rgb sparkfun leds?And what is the status of this project?I am looking to use this in the matrix board for sequencer. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cimo Posted March 5, 2008 Report Share Posted March 5, 2008 hino i use bicolor leds from ledtuning.nl but beware that they are common anode.I would wait a bit if you don t want to experiment yourself.Afaik both me and Bugfight are doing other stuff atm so i can t offer a finished idea/development for those buttons.Anyway i can confirm that they are fully usable for MBssimone Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Twin-X Posted March 5, 2008 Report Share Posted March 5, 2008 Thanks Simone,It is because i just bought a monome 40h kit and finished it.However it is not worth the price.On my planning is still a 4x16 grid button monome clone with midi and the 4x8 + 4x1 grid for mbseq 3.So i was just wondering how far you guys are. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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