Hi guys Thanks for all the replies! I'll have a crack at talking to this guy in Melbourne, he may be helpful. I have looked at the Behringer controllers - they are good, and cheap. I like the look of the microKontrol as well. I might even try creating some mega controller by using a triggerfinger, a microkontrol, a Behringer BCR2000 - while I work on building my own custom made one... Has anyone out there found any of these controllers sufficient when operating Ableton Live (5)? It's the fact that Live gives you those dot in the grid graphics that makes me lament the lack of joysticks on commercially available controllers. You really need a joystick for the delay, one for the chorus, one for the flanger, one for the phaser, one for the auto filter etc. etc. For anyone interested there is short video at www.ableton.com with a crazy german and his custom made controller. It looks cool, though still lacking in joysticks... Cheers!