jimhenry
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Posts posted by jimhenry
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By "example" they mean it is a full and complete INI file as an example. What you get by default when you first load MIDIIO128 is compiled in as part of the program. I believe the example INI file will configure MIDIIO128 to what those defaults are.
Save a copy of midio128.ini under a different name. Edit midio128.ini to get the configuration you need and save it. (Just do a few lines to make sure you are getting the result you want before doing everything.) Run make.bat to generate a new midio128.syx. Check the date to make sure you have updated the SYX file. Use something like SysExBox to upload the SYX file to the MidiBox. Once you get the hang of it you can generate a new SYX and upload it in less time than it took me to type this message.
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So I solder the DIL header to the LCD, and use the IDC to snap on the ribbon cable and plug into the DIL header? Does the CORE also accept an IDC on a DIL header? Do I need to solder the headers or just plug them in?
Also, my LCD and two rows of 7 on one end and the two power connections on the other.
Start from the CORE, it is the more standardized part of a MidiBox. You will solder a DIL header to the CORE PCB. A 2x8 IDC connector on a ribbon cable plugs into that. That puts the 16 LCD signals on specific wires within the ribbon cable. (Do you have my PDF guide to cabling an LCD?) Now you have to look at where those signals go on your LCD. It is unlikely that they go in the same places as they would be in another IDC connector but maybe you'll be lucky. One can change the order of the wires to some extent in an IDC connector but it is tricky and not terribly reliable. I wouldn't suggest it if you don't have experience dealing with IDC connectors. Most likely you'll have to solder the wires of the ribbon cable to the LCD.
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To program the second PIC just be sure that the processor ID is set correctly in SysExBox, MIOS Studio, or whatever tool you are using to upload the programming.
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Also the board has a pedal too does this mean I have to add a analogue input board too?
You can add up to 8 analog inputs directly to the Core. If you use the MIDIIO128 project, and you should to handle the DIN board inputs from the pedal switches, you need a minor modification to that code to process the analog input. The topic was discussed on the Miditzer virtual organ forum and modified code was posted. You'll need to register on that forum to see this topic area:
http://www.jbwebserver.net/mforum/forum_posts.asp?TID=1139
I think there are posting here that discuss it but maybe not quite so reduced to a cookbook approach.
Also I'm really knew to this to upload to the pic can I just use a basic pic development kit say from Rapid or similar?There are suppliers of low cost PCBs and kits for building MidiBoxes. Look in the Wiki.
Does the core module have the Midi out built in or do I need a further board?MIDI In and Out are provided by the Core module.
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I was actually think about 1/2" or 3/8" for the magnets because I don't want them to actuate the switches of adjacent pedals. Have you had good luck with 1/2"?
I'm just at the point of trying to figure out how I am going to support the reed switches. So far all I've done is to experiment with possible positions and orientations. I can say the positioning is not intuitive. My magnets are attached to L brackets that were originally used to close mechanical switches in the console. (This is a pedalboard from a Conn 652.) They have their flat surface parallel to the floor. The best position for the reeds seems to be off to one side of the magnet, with perhaps a 1/4" gap. Remember that the magnetic field is something like a doughnut with the magnet in the hole. The field is strongest somewhere beyond the magnet.
The concern about activating adjacent switches is legitimate. As best I can tell, it doesn't look like it will be a problem using the 3/4" magnets. The other concern is to have the switch activate at about the halfway point on pedal travel and then not drop out as the pedal bottoms out. That seems a bit trickier as far as finding the best setup. Since 50 of these magnets are about $7, it is no disaster if you change your mind about the size.
One suggestion I received is to attach the reed switches using beeswax so they can be repositioned if necessary.
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I did an ebay search for an LCD here. It's 20x2, like the one on SmatshTV that was sold out. What do you think?
Too expensive. Try this:
The pedals currently have no switches at all, which is why I wanted to add the reed switches. My idea to is connect a magnet to the end of each pedal. On a piece of wood which will be mounted at the end of the pedalboard, I'll connect the reed switches. This way all of the electronics will be on that board, so if I ever need to take it off, just a few screws will disconnect it from the pedalboard. The only thing left with the pedalboard would be the magnets.That will work but you have to do some fiddling to figure out the orientation and location of the reeds.
I went to the Mouser site to look for reed switches. They have way to many options for me to know which one to get. Can you be more specific? There's a Michael's locally, I'll stop there for the magnets. Any suggestions on the size/strength of the magnets?Mouser 816-RI-01BAA should work. As should the ProMAG 3/4" round button magnets.
I'm a little confused on the ribbon cables. How do these connect to the DIN board? How does the board know which cable is connected to which note? The 8 wires for the common ground...are these connected to each other, or are they connected internally on the board? Other than the 32 note and one ground connection, what else do I need to anticipate?The newest DIN boards from SmashTV use a 10 pin IDC connector for the inputs. There is a configuration table you'll use to define what each input does. You can connect any or all of the 8 common wires to the switches. Anticipate asking a lot more questions. ;D But seriously, you just have to dive in and start doing this. You can't ask and anticipate everything before you start.
Is it hard to connect the LCD?No harder than a pedalboard. ;D I wrote a PDF guide on how to do it.
Is there a power connection needed, or is it powered through the midi cable?You need a "wall wart" for power. You probably have something that will work if you save them from all the electronics junk that you throw out.
Since you seem like a meticulous sort, take notes and pictures of the project as you go and write a guide on how to do this sort of thing when you are done. More and more people want to create MIDIfied pedalboards.
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I see the LCP, number 49, but it's sold out. Is there an alternative I can use or can it be left out?
Make the effort to find an LCD panel. It is a great help for your first MIDIbox.
There are 32 pedals, I'm not sure how the wiring works. Would two 16-pin ribbon cables do it, or do I need 4? And I see the ribbon cable connectors just above them.You need 4 10-pin ribbon cables for SmashTVs DIN board. 8 wires in each cable are used for inputs and the other two have the common connection.
How do I do the actual connection to the pedals? In my reading I saw that magnetically actuated reed switches are the most reliable option. What do you think? Do you know where to get those and magnets?You can get reed switches from Mouser. I'll dig up a specific part number and post it later. You can get a pack of 50 magnets at Michaels. I'd suggest working out your switches before you even bother to order the MIDIbox kits. It is likely to be the most time consuming part because you have to work out the mechanical aspect of supporting things. A pedalboard needs to be sturdy. It will take a lot of abuse.
However I do it, there are two leads to the switch, so 32 x 2 = 64 connections at the pedals. That's why I'm thinking I'll need 4 16-pin ribbon cables. How do you know which wire from the ribbon goes to which pedal?One side of all the switches will we wired together and connected to the common connection. The other sides of the switches will be the 32 inputs. So you have 33 connections to make. There will be 8 wires available for that 33rd common connection.
Which type of wiring configuration does the Core kit use?The Core kit doesn't "use" any particular type of wiring configuration in the sense you are asking. It is the "brains" of a MIDIbox and it normally only connects to other MIDIbox boards like the DIN. The type of wiring configuration used depends on the "project" (software program) you load into the MIDIbox. You'll want the MIDIIO128 project which uses 1 to 1 inputs.
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Sparx;
I am planning a similar project using lots of solenoids like the one being discussed here. Am I correct in saying that although the output of the ULN2803 is "inverted", it is still a suitable device for driving a bank of relays used to power solenoids?
Thanks; Ciaran
Yes, you can drive relays and small solenoids with the ULN2803. The issue is what is hooked up full time to the other coil wire. If you use the ULN2803 you hook the full time connection to +5 volts. The ULN2803 connects the other end to ground when the ULN output is on.
Most people find that arrangement counter-intuitive, or at least they did before solid state electronics became commonplace. Older devices like most pipe organs typically have the full time connection to ground so you have source the positive voltage to turn the device on.
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Are the ULN2803s going to work for my positive keying? A friend of mine who's into electronics and MIDI said that the 2803 would only work for negative keying.
-Trevor
Your friend is right. 2803s connect positive to ground when on.
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Strictly speaking the LCD is optional but I consider it mandatory for your first MidiBox. You should start by getting the Core working with the LCD display. There is no easy way to test the DOUT boards without a working Core. Having the LCD makes is easier to see if things are working. You'll be able to move the LCD from Core to Core as you bring more of the system on-line.
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JohnC,
I believe that Trevor want to add a MIDI Player to his functioning organ. The Midibox will be a second "console." The MIDI Out will control the DOUT pins to do the same job as pressing a key. So what he will have is a key contact and a DOUT pin wired together to one input of his relay.
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Hi Trevor,
I assume that the Midibox would be wired in parallel to your console? This should work. You will want to focus on the MIDIIO128 project. You will need at least 2 Cores with up to 4 DOUT boards for each Core. You can have a maximum of 128 outputs on each Core. Midiboxes are easily chained together to get as many outputs as necessary.
You'll need to look at the output drivers of the DOUT board to determine what is needed to match the electrical characteristics of the console and to determine if there are any current capacity issues.
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Hi Trevor,
Congratulations on what you have done so far. Very nice installation.
Are you asking if you can use a Midibox as your organ relay? I believe the answer is a heavily qualified yes. Midibox can generate the on/off signals you need to drive the pipe valves and the actions for the draw knobs. Midibox can also read the inputs from the keys, pedals, stops, and pistons.
The heavy qualification is that the existing programming can do three things with all of that. 1) Translate those inputs into MIDI messages. 2) Translate MIDI messages to control the outputs. 3) Directly couple 1 on/off input to 1 on/off output.
You need two things. 1) An organ relay that takes a stop and a note input and logically combines them to produce a pipe output. 2) A combination action that has a settable combination memory so that a piston input produces many outputs to control the draw knobs as set in the combination memory.
If you can program the PIC microprocessor that is the brains of a Midibox, then it probably wouldn't be terribly difficult to create an organ relay and a combination action. You could also use Midibox to create MIDI Input that goes to a PC and take MIDI Out from the PC to control the pipes and draw knobs, and use something like jOrgan on the PC to be your relay and combination action. But if you want an off the shelf solution then I'd suggest looking at a commercial solution. I believe Opus Two and Artisan have relatively low cost organ relays/combination actions that would meet your needs.
Hope this helps.
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Considering the potential length of future posts, I feel it best that we go to email to continue.
Please keep the posts on the Forum. This project should result in a major addition to the inventory of general purpose MidiBox projects. We need the record of the development publicly archived if that is to happen.
I am planning to make a portable organ console by assembling two or three inexpensive MIDI keyboards into a single case with proper inter-keyboard spacing. It will be a good test vehicle for this project but I won't be able to get to the project for a few months. So it looks like hardware for thorough testing is going to be the tall nail.
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I believe the 2803s include suppression diodes. Does the MIDIIO128 allow you to configure the output to send pulses? You don't want to leave the SAMs continuously energized.
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Are you mean big table with 256 positions for set 256 messages?
I can put this if if you want. Maybe better is write exacly what you need for your instrument than create many purpose code..
Thinking out loud here so this may be completely wrong thinking, but...
As I recall, MIDIIO128 uses a .ini file that must be assembled into the resulting executable. Since scan matrix has so far been derived from MIDIIO128 I believe it has inherited this method. I also believe that more recent MidiBox projects have been able to organize their configuration data in a way that permits uploading just the configuration data without the need to reassemble the project.
Undoubtedly it would be a much bigger effort, but perhaps it would be worthwhile to upgrade MIDIIO128 to use a configuration table that can be uploaded without the need to reassemble the project in a way that is consistent with other MidiBox projects and tools. By extension, this same configuration technique would be used for scan matrix as well.
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I think by "reed relays" you really mean reed switches or maybe leaf switches. Relays are electrically actuated switches. If it is a magnet closing a switch in a glass tube, that's a reed switch.
To encode the pedal switch closures to MIDI you will need 1 MidiBox Core and 1 DIN board. You'll use the MIDIIO128 project. The DIN board provides a common wire for one side of the switches. The other side of each switch is wired to one of the 32 input pins on the DIN board. You will define the MIDI messages generated by switch on and off in a table that will be loaded into the Core via MIDI.
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Here are some possible sources for a 16x2 character LCD:
http://www.futurlec.com/LCDDisp.shtml
http://www.junun.org/markiii/Info.jsp?item=35
http://www.allelectronics.com/cgi-bin/item/LCD-117/365/16_CHARACTER_X_2_LINE_LCD_.html
No, I can't troubleshoot a board from a picture.
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Do you have an LCD connected to your CORE? If not, that is a must for you.
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Thanks guys. Well this is frustrating, I have uploaded midiox128 and connected in the described way, I am using a multi-meter to test the lamp voltage, since these cannot yet be connected, but I'm not getting the result I expect.
The PS ground is connected to Vs on J3, all the output pins on J3 read the output voltage (12V) when the unit is powered up. Sending midi messages does not seem to change this state (90 30 7F/90 30 00). Note that the output on J4-J6 are
Any thoughts on what might be going wrong/things to check?
James
The outputs are open collector outputs. When they are turned ON the output pins are connected to ground. When the are OFF they are disconnected from anything. You'll need to connect a resistor, 10K would be a reasonable choice to the output pin you want to measure. Connect the other end to some positive voltage, 5 volts would be a good choice for the initial testing. Now the output should read 5 volts when OFF and 0 volts when on.
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Vs is shorthand for Vss which is ground. You can connect the 12V PSU ground to any or all of J3 to J6 Vs pins.
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Are you trying to provide MIDI control of a real Hammond? If so, I think the drawbars are mechanically moving a pickup relative to the tone wheels. That would be a challenge to control with MIDI. You would need some sort of servo mechanism to physically move things.
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The ULN "inputs" (really outputs) where you connect the lamps, are solid state switches to ground. Everything else on the ULN is connected either to ground, regulated +5v, or a signal that moves between ground and +5V. If you measure the voltage where the lamp is connected to the ULN when the ULN pin is OFF, you'll see the unregulated +12v. But it is not connected to anything by the ULN. The ULN is open switch at this point. When the ULN closes the switch, there will be a low resistance connection to ground and you will only see a low voltage at the pin.
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If the supply is really 5 volts then it won't be sufficient for the MIDIbox. The Core includes a voltage rectifier and regulator. It needs more than 5 volts to produce a regulated 5 volts. This from the description of the Core at uCapps:
J1 Connection to the powersupply. Either the output of a 7V-10V transformer, or a wall adapter can be used. 500 mA is recommented, especially if a backlit display is used, but MIDIfilter and MIDImerger work also with ca. 100 mA. AC or DC doesn't matter, since the rectifier behind J1 converts to DC anyhow. Also the polarity has not to be taken into account.
The lamps don't care about AC or DC but the 2803s do. You have to power the lamps with DC but it can just be rectified AC. I'd suggest using full-wave rectification. Connect the negative terminal of the 12v rectifier to the systemwide DC ground. Connect the positive terminal to one terminal of the lamp. Connect the other lamp terminal to the outputs of the 2803 which will connect the lamps to ground when ON.
Getting the CORE and DINs to operate on Chan 2
in MIDIfication
Posted
I would suggest working with just Middle C until you get a handle on things. Middle C is MIDI Note 60 decimal or 3C hex. Once you have Middle C sending the right note then you should be able to do the rest.
However, I note you say you have channels 1 and 2 working but you specifically say that the Great manual is off by a major third. This seems to suggest that the Accompaniment manual is right and the Great is off by 4, Middle C playing 40 hex rather than 3C. Are you doing this by musical pitches or have you looked at the actual numerical values being sent in MIOS Studio or MIDI-OX?