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Hello, Is there a simple way to get midibox SID v 1.7.303a so that AOUT's 5,6,7 output 1V/Oct. instead of V/Hz? This is easy in Midibox CV (under the output curve option menu), but after an hour digging through .inc files I can't track down any mention of the chaging the AOUT output mode. -gerald

Okay, so I must be blind, but the midi_evnt.inc file wasn't included with midibox SID v 1.7303, or earlier versions that I have either. What am I missing? ???

Greetings, I finally got around to installing the latest SID OS, with '303' control, and have been loving it. I was hoping that the pitch of the sequence would be mapped to an output on the AOUT, and once again I need to dig into the source files to figure out the AOUT hard-coded routing. I'm having a hell of a time finding where in the code this is laid out... there are something like 60 files to wade through. Any idea which file/files define the AOUT routing? I Finally got around to posting some pictures and details on my modular midibox SID here: http://home.earthlink.net/~erinys/tech.htm -gerald

Thought this video was of interest to this thread. Robert Rich (big name in synthetic music to say the least) is demo-ing new modules (frac format!) by Synthesis Technology http://www.sonicstate.com/news/shownews.cfm?newsid=2645 About half-way through, he starts playing with a new midi-CV converter, and goes nuts about its arpeggiation and micro-tuning capability. Basically, watching this video shows the kind of response the midibox CV could/will get from the modular synth / DIY community. I love the idea of just switching applications on my Frac-SID to the CV program when I'm not in the mood to use the SID's oscillators, and filter. Makes a wonderfully versatile module that much more versatile! http://www.midibox.org/forum/index.php?topic=4963.0

Nothing that I can see.... this list makes me drool! -gerald

Looks fantastic - will have to try it out. Thanks for supporting for the old AOUT board. Love the idea of the low cost AOUT... I may have to build one just to try it out, even though I have the "high-cost" version already. Since my dream of modifying the source code in C died due to my sticking with the out-dated Windows Me, I'd like to add these feature requests to this program. 1. LFO's to modulate the AOUTS 2. 6 analog inputs (not from the AIN board, but just the 6 inputs from the core) that map/mix to AOUTS 3. A "sophisticated" note quantizer. Reads AIN, and quantizes it to various scales / keys. The result is sent to an AOUT. 4. A matrix mixer - mix AIN's and LFO's to AOUTS 5. An arpeggiator Most of these features have been written for SID 1.7a... maybe it'd be easy to add them to CV 1.1? If I ever upgrade to Xp (or it may be Longhorn before I get around to it), I'll give it a try. -just dreaming... these features would make this CV controller more sophisticated than any available on the market! -gerald

Glad to see the list back up again! I got my AOUT board working with CV_v1_0, and calibrated the output by setting the output to 9 V for the maximum octave my keyboard puts out. It seems to track 1V/octave pretty well now.  I switched back to SID software, and it seems to be working. I have searched the code for quite some time, and I still cannot find where (or which) parameters are mapped to CV outputs...? Now, once I figure this out, I would _love_ to try out the "bended midibox SID" firmware... is there a link to this somewhere? -gerald

Hello, I finally got the pieces together, and built an AOUT board, and am trying to test it out. I tried to run CV_v1_0 to set up the board, and adjust trimpots, but I'm not getting anything from the outputs, or the gate signals either. Power light is on, though! I figured that the problem is that I have AOUT connected to the CORE module via J6 on the Core, and not J10 which is what midibox_CV is probably set for. Is there a enable_J6 burried in the included files somewhere? Assuming I get the board working in CV mode, I'll need to get it working with midibox_SID. I switched the enable_AOUT on in main.asm, but couldn't find where parameters are mapped to the CV's. Which file contains these "hard-wired" definitions? -gerald

Greetings. I replaced the old-design psu with the new "optimized" one over the weekend, and no more 60Hz hum! Problem is, it is replaced with high frequency SID noise that is in tune with the notes being played. Even worse, the freekin' stuff is running through the ground of my whole modular synthensizer - I hear it even with the Sid output disconnected from my VCA. Two ideas what it could be - 1. I have a single ground point coming from the "center ground pin" on the 7 pin DIN from the C64 power supply that goes to the ground of all of the 1/8" input/output jacks. The mbhp_4xsid_c64_psu_optimized.pdf doesn't show where to connect a "global" ground like this, maybe this ground is picking up noise? 2. I didn't add a 2200uF cap as shown next to comment #5 - since there is a similar cap on the input side. Also, I only have a single SID module hooked up, and wasn't sure if this cap was necessary? Another question - I built an amplifier/attenuator for the output/input of the SID to bring its output and input levels to values resonable for a modular synth. My PAiA wants 10V p-p oscillator voltages. Any idea what the output voltage range is for the SID? Also, what does it want to see on its input? What is its input impedance? Thanks for any ideas you may have, -gerald

I tried it - but something terrible is happening, I believe with SDCC - I keep getting general protection faults, and other errors that crash my computer HARD. I was getting these errors with the previous version of the makefile.bat, and I suspect it is something about windoze ME. I'd love to keep fighting with this, but I worry about corrupting my hard-disk with so many hard-boots. Maybe I should make a DOS boot disk, and try to run it without windows in the background? -gerald

I have spent about 4 hours trying to get the makefile to work in WinME... and the best I could do, was to find workaround for the problem with having a string defined with an = character in it. Just split the string in two or three, around the offensive = symbol, and when you execute the strings later on, add the = symbol. For example, [tt] set MIOS_WRAPPER_DEFINES=-DSTACK_HEAD set MIOS2=0x37f -DSTACK_IRQ_HEAD set MIOS3=0x33f %GPASM% %MIOS_WRAPPER_DEFINES%=%MIOS2%=%MIOS3% [/tt] Crude, but this works. Now my problems seem to have become much worse - my system hangs when I run the make.bat file. Haven't had much time to fight this... would rather solder boards really. -gerald

I think I found the major problem with the batch file syntax. Commands like set SDCC_DEFINES=-DDEBUG_MODE=0 make DOS 8.0 throw up - it doesn't like the second = sign. I can't think of a way around this - I may end up having to type everything in by hand at the command line. -gerald

Yes - my paths are correct. I found some info online that indicates many batch commands from NT/XP/2000 are incompatible with old DOS based machines. Example - in the clean.bat file if exist _output del /s /q _output My DOS version 8.0 doesn't support the /q switch. Don't know why, but it doesn't. I'll keep plugging away at modifying make.bat so that it works. With this set of examples, you have covered just about everything on my wish-list! Not only that, but I have always been a wannabe programmer - I can modify examples much much faster than I can program from scratch. So, armed with these examples, I'm going to have a great time. Let us know when they're posted! Thanks much! -gerald

Posted by: drsyncenstein But the problem is, building the electronics is so much easier compared to writing the software, that iguess very few midiboxers are able to code this. ----------- I'm going to give it a go. I installed the C wrapper stuff, but have been running into some problems with make.bat giving me syntax error file not found (x3) Out of environment space (x3) Assembling MIOS SDCC wrapper Bad command or file name. ================ Compiling pic18f452.c Bad command or file name (x3) blah blah blah. It seems like the syntax of the dos batch file is not happy with my Win ME. Ah.... a little web-searching and I found that NT's batch language is pretty much incompatible with the DOS 8.0 that ME runs. I'll try to translate it, but it may be hopeless... Stinkin' old computer... -gerald

A friend of mine purchased one of these over a year ago, and hasn't received it yet... http://www.synthmodules.com/psim-1.htm Looking at its specifications, it looks like a Midibox CORE module, with an AOUT board could easily do everything that this thing can, perhaps even more, since it will have midi I/O as well. How difficult would it be to program something like a quantizer, or S/H for such a module? Would it make sense to start with the Midibox CV program, and modify it, or from some other program like the Midibox seq (sequencing would be a really nice feature too)? If this worked, and was easy enough to write applications for, there would be a pretty large demand for such a versatile beast! I suppose a C++ editor would be a little easier to deal with - is this in the works, or just a dream at this point? -gerald

My last comment may have been right on the money... nobody uses AIN for the analog LFO waveform inputs, do they?  They just put the CORE in unmuxed mode, and put the inputs directly onto RA0 - RA5? That would explain why the v1.7 main.asm code had it unmuxed, and it would explain why nobody is chiming in with answers to my AIN problems - because they don't use AIN boards with SID's? Ok - Just yanked the AIN board altogether, and connected A0-A5 to Core J5... and it works beautifully, absolutely beautifully! I'm tempted to delete this thread... -gerald

In keeping with tradition, I will reply to my own post again. There are three AIN example files posted, ain_example1_v1_3.zip, ain_example2_v1_3.zip, and ain_example3_v1_3.zip. ain_example1_v1_3.zip Purpose: ;  -> Sends a MIDI event (CC #7) when first pot (#0) is moved ;  -> Prints the value on LCD This example turns off multiplexing. If you have AIN inputs A0-A5 wired as shown in the AIN PDF, and you run this program hoping to check your AIN board, you will find that it only responds when you apply a signal to pin 13 on the 4051 chip. This is input A6, NOT A0. I thought I had a wiring problem, but if you look at the datasheet for the CD4051B, pin thirteen is channel 0. In fact, the channel assignments are all mucked up relative to their designation in MBHP_AINX4_V2a.pdf. Now, I thought I had to rewire everything... unless the _software_ untangled this mess for me. So I modified ain_example1_v1_3.zip in the following way so that it would be relevant to the midibox SID. USER_Init movlw 0x06 ; enable the first 6 analog inputs call MIOS_AIN_NumberSet ;; use the AIN 4051 multiplexers movlw 0x03 ; 8 bit resolution call MIOS_AIN_Muxed I ran the program, and put an LFO into each input A0-A5 as identified in the AIN PDF, and what do you know - it works beautifully! I can watch the input value oscillate slowly, exactly as it should, and it gets the input channel number right. So - multiplexed, the A0-A5 inputs are labeled properly. Unmuxed, they're quite different. I modified the Midibox SID v1.7 input from #if ENABLE_AIN_LFO_WAVEFORM movlw 0x06 ; enable the first 6 analog inputs call MIOS_AIN_NumberSet call MIOS_AIN_UnMuxed ; not multiplexed movlw 0x03 ; 8 bit resolution #endif to #if ENABLE_AIN_LFO_WAVEFORM movlw 0x06 ; enable the first 6 analog inputs call MIOS_AIN_NumberSet movlw 0x03 ; 8 bit resolution call MIOS_AIN_Muxed ; multiplexed #endif Minor changes, but... why would you enable 6 inputs, and then have it unmuxed? And, shouldn't the movlw come before the call statement? Now my SID is capable of being modulated, and the inputs are numbered correctly. I wish that everything were running perfectly, but... it sounds like the modulation is hopping values from 0 to the AIN input value and back. For example - if I run a ramp into AIN0, with values 0,5,10,15,20,25,30,35,40,45 etc. It seems to be modulating the pitch like this: 0,5,0,10,0,15,0,20,0,25, etc. Really rough sounding. The modified ain_example1_v1_3.zip shows that the CORE is getting the input right, so I would guess that somehow, it just isn't sending exactly these values to the pitch of the oscillator. I can hear the pitch rise and fall, with the un-shifted note underlying it. Kind of like wavetable arpeggios on a SID, oscillating between pitches really fast. Since my posts on this subject have been met with silence - I'm beginning to wonder if anyone uses the AIN inputs as LFO's on their SID? -gerald

Good news, I got my AIN module working with my MidiBox SID. Weird thing is... A0-A5 are reversed??? I'm using the SmashTV board, and in order to figure out what the heck was going wrong, I uploaded the ain_example2_v1_3 program. This one checks POT 0 for activity. It sat there, doing nothing until I ran an LFO into A5. What the Heck? I re-installed MboxSID V1.7 and tried running an LFO into A0, and when I set LFO6's waveform to AIN, sure enough, it worked??? It isn't modulating much, even though the LFO is puting out 0-3.5V. What does the AIN module expect on the input? What are A6 and A7 for on the board? I have these connected to the front-panel, and they're normally grounded. I ran a square-wave from the LFO into A6, and the modulation amount jumps every time the square wave is high. Are these trigger inputs? Should I connect them to 5V when they're not in use? Any ideas on what is going on would be much appreciated. -gerald

gb, That's great news about the AOUT board! Do you recommend that I try to order an AOUT module from the german dist. mikes-elektronikseite, or should I wait for the V2 board that is reportedly in the works? http://69.56.171.55/~midibox/forum/index.php?topic=4891.0 Here is a pic of my FracSID. I posted this under a new thread about AIN problems I'm having, but I might as well copy it here too. It is obviously a work in progress. I didn't label anything, because it is easy to guess what's what. Top row AIN, with two extra jacks TBD. Bottom row is reserved for AOUT whenever I get one together. Bottom right is for SID-IN and SID-Out. You can't tell, but the LCD is backlit with a lovely white LED. Very easy to read. I'll take a picture of it's guts when I'm through with it (probably months from now). -gerald

Greetings I am trying to get my AIN to work with my MidiboxSID. I checked, and it's getting 5V - and it seems to be connected properly to the CORE. I grounded A0-A7 on J2, J3, and J4, and left IC2, IC3, and IC4 in place. I set the LFO1 wav. to AIN, and had this LFO modulate oscillator pitch. I put a 0 - 3.5V staircase LFO input into the A0 input of J1, and it doesn't seem to modulate the pitch at all. In fact, it drops the pitch really low, so you cannot hear it. Switching back to SIN modulates the oscillator fine - AIN kills it. Can I use MIOSStudio to check to see what's wrong? I tried querying MIOS_AIN_LastPinsGet and then putting the input oscillator into A0-A5, hoping to see it change as I switched inputs. It just changed from 04 05 to 05 04 (can't remember exactly what these params were). Do I need AIN.INC? Seems like MidiboxSID v1.7 is set up for the AIN module (ENABLE_AIN_LFO_WAVEFORM 1). Anyway, here is a picture of my FracSid. It is obviously a work in progress. I didn't label anything, because it is easy to guess what's what. Top row AIN, with two extra jacks TBD. Bottom row is reserved for AOUT whenever I get one together. Bottom right is for SID-IN and SID-Out. thanks for listening to me ramble, -gerald

Well... after struggling with some missing solder, and an LCD that is blank except for when one of the trim-pots is all the way down, my Frac-SID is working! I built the whole thing to mount in a PAIA Frac-rack 3U blank panel. It has a 16x2 LCD (no room for larger), 6 CV inputs, and a planned 8 CV outs (once I figure out how to get ahold of an AOUT board!). Only one knob (encoder), but tons of VC possibilities! I'll be using it with my PAIA 9710, and Moog-ladder filter EFM VCF-2F. This filter kit is cheap, but 3 months after purchasing it, I'm still waiting for a dozen missing parts! EFM should be taken over by SmashTV... whose service and kits are impeccable! Although it doesn't seem like the AOUT can be set to give a 1V/Oct CV signal that tracks note value, I'm planning to run MIDI through my PAIA MIDI to CV, and then to the SID. This way, I can use pitch CV to have the filter track the SID. Simple solution for the time being. One last question, then it's back to tweaking - I am using a Bourns encoder with switch that I bought from SmashTV - It's indented, right? What parameters do I need to set in the main.asf file for this encoder? It's working fine, but tends to skip a bit - I think it needs some fine-tuning. -gerald

Thanks for the response. I yanked the stack of boards, and checked the solder joints, and... sure enough, I had (embarrassed here) missed soldering one of the J1 pins! Easy fix. - Now my SID is making noise. It isn't really in tune, but it's making noise. Now, on to getting my LCD and CS working. I transfered "setup_6581_with_cs.syx", but that wasn't enough to get the LCD working... will have to dig through the FAQ. What are the two trimpots on the Core board for? Tuning? LCD contrast? One more question. The SID chip I'm using is flawed - one of the three voices doesn't work. I discovered this using Triad's MIDISLAVE. Does Midibox SID use all three voices? -gerald

Hello, I am trying to get my MBox sid up and running - have both the Core and SID boards stuffed, and built the power supply as in mbhp_sid_c64_psu.pdf. It seems like everything is connected properly, but when I turn it on, the 5V output from IC3 hits 5V, sits there for 3 sec., and then drops to about 1.5V. It doesn't get hot (I don't leave it on for more than 5 seconds though). Any idea what could cause this? The 12V IC4 on the SID-R2 board keeps its voltage fixed at 12V. I checked the Cap and diode polarities on the CORE board, and they're all fine. Bad voltage regulator? A little more info - the input voltage to IC3 is also dropping. From 12 V to a couple volts. Not surprisingly, IC3 regulates ok until the input drops below 5V. Hmmm... the plot thickens. Another quick question - Should the second pin of J1 on the SID board (Vs) be connected to ground? Seems weird just leaving it floating... -gerald

Greetings, I am working on a project to build a CV controlled Midibox SID in a Frac-rack format for my modular synthesizer. I need to build an AOUT module so that I can have the FracSid control filters, S/H circuits, etc. Problem is... AOUT uses expensive DACs that are reportedly difficult to get ahold of. I contacted Tim/Smash TV and asked if he was planning on printing up the AOUT boards, and his reply is attached below. He has a new board designed that uses cheaper/available components, and includes the SHX8 board as part of the design! He needs interest from 15 people before he would be willing to print up a batch of circuit boards - any takers/comments? -gerald ------ Hi Gerald! The short answer is no, Due to difficult availability of the DAC chip that is used in the design. Long answer: There is another AOUT module in the works, no idea when it will be done (I'm not working on this one personally) but it will have a much easier to obtain parts list. That $30 DAC chip and the out-of-production sample & hold chips for the SHX8 sidecar are the only reasons for the re-design. Aside from those two issues, it's a really great design. You might be able to "rally the troops" in the forum to find other people who want pro made AOUT+SHX8 boards, we would need 15 people willing to spend $10 each to fund the fabrication run. I should be able to save on the massive setup costs by combining the two on one board. And you can count me in for one of these myself at this price if you decide to go this route, so only 13 more needed. ; ) Let me know what you think! Best Tim aka SmashTV