Concept for SSL Controller, Help needed

[crunchie]

Greetings everyone,

I have the intention of building a DIY Midi Controller to complement my DVS Dj Setup (Serato Scratch Live). A similar commercial product has been released by Native Instruments called the Kontrol X1. I have decided to create a similar product more suited to my needs and built around SSL's workflow, as well as a nicely machined faceplate with proper labels. The Purpose of this controller would only be limited to triggering cue points, setting/automating loops, assigning/controlling effects and library navigation.

Given that i do go ahead with this project i will most definately document a build log, however for all intensive purposes ill give a brief overview of my controller separated below

- [16 arcade buttons in 4x4 arrangement]

inspired from the DjTechTools' Midifighter. I have chosen to implement the arcade buttons for tactile response & feel to cover the functions of cue-point triggering, tapping bpm & loop triggering

- [Effects Section] 6 pots, 8 buttons

- [Library Section] 2 pots, 1 rotary encoder, 4 buttons

As far as the hardware side of things go, I have completed several other DIY Projects in the past so the soldering/assembly side of things shouldn't be too much of an issue. In regards to the Core configuration, I'd have to thank those responsible for ucapps.de page, as the documentation is excellent and easy to follow (+1 DIY Communities =])

Nevertheless, my questions are as follows;

1. I understand that the MidiBox 64E project is the one I am interested in. This is because i have chosen to implement a rotary encoder under the Library section for scrolling through tracks, otherwise the Midibox64 would have been my choice. My question is, am i right to assume that the only difference between the two is that i will have a rotary encoder connected to 2 pins on a DIN Module and that i will still be able to have all the buttons, knobs and pots as per my configuration above.

2. I am interested in using a shift-modifier to change functions of the pots/buttons. I understand that the Bank function is what Im interested in but my understanding of it and its use to my application is still a bit unclear. I want to be able to have separate bank select modes for the Effects and Arcade button section...

i.e. [Effects Section] i would like a button dedicated to changing the function of the pots. Initially, the pots will be assigned to control the superknobs of each of the effects. At the push of a button, i would like those same knobs to be assigned to different CC commands to act as a scroll knob for changing the type of effect (e.g. reverb, delay, etc)

[4x4 Arcade Button Section] In a similar fashion, i would like another button dedicated to changing the 16 buttons to different midi notes which can be assigned to different fuctions.

What I'm not exactly sure about, is whether or not i can use 2 seperate bank selection buttons (1 for each section) to alter the inputs independently, meaning changing the bank of the knobs will have no effect on the arcade buttons and vice versa.

Any comments, help, suggestions would be very much appreciated.

Cheers

Edited May 24, 2010 by crunchie

[Fozzy The Bear]

Nobody answering you.... OK I'll try answer a few of them.

1. My question is, am i right to assume that the only difference between the two is that i will have a rotary encoder connected to 2 pins on a DIN Module and that i will still be able to have all the buttons, knobs and pots as per my configuration above.

Yes.... "Midibox 64E" supports rotary controllers as well as the other controls. Whereas "Midibox 64" has no support for rotary controllers.

2. I want to be able to have separate bank select modes for the Effects and Arcade button section...

Read read read.... The answers to this are in the documentation.

What I'm not exactly sure about, is whether or not i can use 2 seperate bank selection buttons (1 for each section) to alter the inputs independently, meaning changing the bank of the knobs will have no effect on the arcade buttons and vice versa.

Easy!! ..... You would however need a bank for each possible combination to achieve that on a single core. So for example:

Bank 1 = Buttons in state 1, pots in state 1.

Bank 2 = Buttons in state 1, pots in state 2.

Bank 3 = Buttons in state 2, pots in state 2.

Bank 4 = Buttons in state 2, pots in state 1.

You would then need to do some logic programming to determine which bank to flip to, based on the logic latched state of the two push buttons that you want to use.

So for example:

each of your two selection buttons can have logic written in your program, that flip flops it between one of two states, each time it is pushed: We will call these logic states either, 1 or 2

So:

If button 1 = 1 and Button 2 = 1 then call BANK 1 (which puts Buttons in state 1, pots in state 1)

If button 1 = 2 and Button 2 = 1 then call BANK 4 ((which puts Buttons in state 2, pots in state 1)

If button 1 = 2 and Button 2 = 2 then call BANK 3 ((which puts Buttons in state 2, pots in state 2)

etc etc etc.....

This is not an off the shelf solution, It requires some programming to do this.... But modifying Midibox 64E to achieve it is possible. Assuming you know at least some simple programming in C+ or Visual Basic, which has a very similar structure to the C+ that MIOS programs are written in, learning the Commands for MIOS is then fairly straightforward to achieve.

The other way to do it would be to run two separate cores... in which case you could bank switch each core separately.

Hope that gives you something to think about. I'm sure there are other ways to do it as well, but these will work.

Best Regards,

Julian (Fozzy The Bear)

Edited May 25, 2010 by Fozzy The Bear

[crunchie]

Thanks alot for the answers!

4 bank combinations, i see that makes a lot of sense haha, guess i didn't think of that.

As far as my programming experience goes, it'd be pretty much non-existant as a project of this kind will be my first.

Would it be beneficial for me to learn the programming required or seek someone out for help?

Also, I was skimming the net for resources and came across the Max/Msp programming environment. Would something like this be worthwhile to learn (given its apparent intuitive nature) to allow me to receive midi input from the Midibox controller and program the bank functions i require that way? The reason I am considering this is because I see it as an option that i would benefit from for future and more complex projects.

Edited May 25, 2010 by crunchie

[Fozzy The Bear]

Would it be beneficial for me to learn the programming required or seek someone out for help?

Good question... personally I think it's always beneficial learning a new skill.. But only you can answer that for yourself. It also depends on how much time you have. If you have the time to do it yourself and learn to write programs then I'd say go for it. What have you got to lose.

As for getting somebody else to do it for you..... You'll mostly find on here that people will help you to understand something and do it for yourself... but they're not too keen on doing it for you. Mainly because people have enough of their own projects to be getting on with.

Can't really answer the last part of your question... No experience of MAX/MSP except to say that the hardware that MAX MSP drives natively is hideously more expensive than Midibox Hardware.... To be honest you really don't need it for Midibox stuff as we already have MIOS which can do most of that anyway. If you think it would be an advantage to you for other things, and again, you have the time and desire to learn it, it's really up to you.

I strongly recommend that you read the WIKI..... http://wiki.midibox.org/

Best Regards,

Julian (Fozzy The Bear)

Edited May 25, 2010 by Fozzy The Bear

[Mudo]

...

It could be useful start a thread with all the "midi mixers" for incoming Bridge (or almost for use with Ableton).

Grid controllers are becoming so popular...

;)

...

[Lowie]

2. I am interested in using a shift-modifier to change functions of the pots/buttons. I understand that the Bank function is what Im interested in but my understanding of it and its use to my application is still a bit unclear. I want to be able to have separate bank select modes for the Effects and Arcade button section...

Isn't it possible to use shift just as a button and map it in serato as a 'modifier'? In traktor it is possible to add 4 (or more) Modifiers and then u can map the commands like 'effect select = encoder+modifier1=1'. This is in traktor but i have never worked with Serato so i'm not sure