jdm terror :( or newbie with another problem

[Guest psytron]

oh the frustration !!

my ingrediants:-

1 jdm built on a pcb from ucapps jdm page

2 pics 18f452

1 core module

1 ain module

1 ltc module

variouse pcs with win xp and me (no laptop)

My first probs:-

built the jdm, tested voltages all good except only 12.97 insted of 14v--- hmm

pluss clock voltage drops slowly (i think this is normal??)

inserted pic

tested voltages on the read of pic

still 12.95 to 12.97 nomatter what pc i use it on (or i/o setting)

figure i will burn it any how

had a few probs with pic burning (error at oooooh or whatever address)

when verify is successfull all info seems good on pic except the config section always comes up with the same values.(these are not the same as mios values)

insert pic into core boot up midiox

and i get the woefull msg of

F0 00 00 7E 40 00 01 F7  continously

am i right in thinking that this msg is sent by pic when it is running but there is no mios running.

i tried reburning the pic many times on variose pcs with different os installed but always the same values in the config section (incorrect ones, i can post if this will help)

Note: my jdm has a 8.2 zener not a 8.7 i cant find one.

i tried a 9.something zener and got the higher voltages for mclr 16v i think and 6v instead of 5v for all other.

adjusted the i/o delay so thet 13.8 was achieved on a pic read then burnt in the mios but still ended up with incorrect config values (same as the old zener).

if anyone has had this b4 and fixed it plz share the wealth :)

at the moment i am looking for someone who lives in Australia (QLD pref) who is kind enuf to burn my pic for me so that i may see if it is infact my core module that is confusin the problem.

so if u liv in oz and have a jdm handy send an email to

dimention11@bigpond.com

my grattitude would be eternal

p.s. tc u rock

[Steven_C]

Hey,

 well if you are getting the F0 00 00 7E 40 00 01 F7  message over sysex, it sounds like you have successfully installed the bootstrap loader! (that 0000h thing is a bit of a worry, though) Check that you have set all the configuration settings as on the 'How to prog' ucapps.de page.

BTW, where did you get your bits from?? I think they have all the right parts at jaycar, for the programmer... if not, then Dick Smith?

Go to the MIOS page (link near the top right, when you first open the ucapps site), then go to the link "bootstrap loader" just under the 'spec' subsection, read the instructions under "solution" heading, and it will all be a lot clearer to you!!

basically, once you burn in the bootstrap loader, you then install mios1.2, (via sysex/midi ox) then install your application (from the mios download page) again, using sysex.

BTW, which application are you building??

.... Steve

oh yeah, I'm in sydney, in case you give up!

[Guest psytron]

alas this is not true

the sysex command comes out of the pic hundreds of times a second (screen is a blur with sysex commands)

when trying to upload mios1.2 or an app i get an error saying that it cannot send info to pic while the pic is sending info...

i do not wish to give up on my pic programming but i would love to get my box running.

i will check out the stuff on ucappes site again tho.

note:- i tried uloading mios1.2 it did not work the same error as b4 cannot sent to pic while the pic is sending (midiox)

(just had 2 weeks away from it al damn this joint moves at great speed)

thanks

p.s. what tunes do you get into in sydney i know a few people there.

[Guest psytron]

i followed the setting up of icprog and midiox to a tee but still no go.

the string i get is F0 00 00 7E 40 00 01  not F0 00 00 7E 40 00 01 F1 like i said b4 (sorry folks i dont get an F1 on the end).

just a thought: my ltc module has all the ic's stuffed into sockets and my core has no optocoupler ths is correct ??

i remember that some of the ics are only used for the led's (leds are not connected i tried a 1.5k resister incase this was the problem but no change was noted )

all my parts came from dicksmiths (no jaycar in cairns closest is 4hrs away by car) and some of the ic's came from a local electronsc warehouse/wholesale type thing.

eventualy i would like something similar to a makie clone

but i am building this box stepwise so i can change my mind is possable.

anyone out there with a system that just loves to burn pics wanna burn mine :)

does anyone have a list of voltages measured for each component on the jdm that i may check against mine this may be where my problem is (i think so but i just cant see it perhaps a new couple of transistors ??)

thx all

[Steven_C]

I would just try uploading the mios anyway....

just open midiox,

View>>Sysex

File>>Send Sysex

locate the mios.syx file (might be named slightly different, can't remember???) and highlight it.

turn on midibox, wait for the F0 00 00 7E 40 00 F7 message, then, within 2 seconds, press 'open' in midiox

then install the application

ltc.... dunno, never built one.

If there are any small parts that you need, that can be posted in an envelope, then I can send them to you if they are only worth a dollar or so... email me...  loonatron@yahoo.com

did you say you had tried it on another pc?

good luck... Steve

[Guest psytron]

i tried the mios1.2 upload it didnt work for the same reason all sysex uploads have failed...

here is the actual sysex/midiox msg

---------------------------------------------------------

sysex output devices: the port is transmitting data to the device. wait until data hes been transmitted, and then try again.

---------------------------------------------------------

i dont have to wait for the "F0 00 00 7E 40 00 01"

as soon as my core is switched on i get this msg at probably 50-100 times a second.

i have tried it on 3 pcs (1 with a power supply from1994, the others are relativly new).

thx for the offer for parts but i can get ahold of what i need up here.( i do not believe it is parts tho).

just a thought does the config part of the pics memory get uploaded with a different pin or specific part of the jdm. perhaps it is time to smash my old jdm and pop out a new one :)

thx for the help steven_c

i wish i had payed more attention when i was at uni :(

[TK.]

Hi Psytron,

ok, lets analyse the problem step by step. I guess that the bootstrap loader has been burned into the PIC correctly - do you see the same effect when the MIDI In is not connected to your PC?

Best Regards, Thorsten.

[Guest psytron]

i am using the ltc module to connect the core to my pc, as i have no midi plugs on my pc.

should i try dissconnecting the rx pin on the com cable??

or perhaps hooking the box up to my midi/game port as per mbhp_midi_gameport.gif on the debug page?

are you suggesting a possable midi feedback on my pc ?

note: i figured something must be getting burnt into the pic as when i didnt put a 100 in the id section of the config sysex recieved many different msg (incorrect baud rate i guess) but when this was in the config i recieved the msg described in my prviouse post.

p.s. cheers for the help

[TK.]

Fine - so the burning procedure was successfull. Yes, you could remove the Rx line for this first test. But before you try the gameport, you could also check the other COM MIDI drivers (there are three different ones from Yamaha, Roland and Kawai... not every driver works correctly with the different Windows versions)

Best Regards, Thorsten.

[Guest psytron]

the com driver i was using was the yamaha one off the com to midi page it seemed ok.

i tried (yammaha driver) switching the in and then the out (midi) in midiox with the following result.

midi in off midi out on nothing

midi in on midi out off -endless streaming of the same msg i was getting b4. "F0 00 00 7E 40 00 01"

i tried the roland driver when switching my midibox on i recieved no msg sometimes and other times 1 to 3 randomish msgs with similar results switching the box off so i guess this driver does not workproperly.

i dl the kawai driver it has 3 files one is the dll and where should i put it (whitch dir on my hd winxppro).

i know this is a dumb question but i couldnt find out where to put it from kawai website.

with dissconnecting my rx pin (on the com cable), can i have the same effect by dissconnecting the wire closest to gnd on j11 of the core module(data in to core module from ltc). i dont wish to pull apart my com cable if possable but hey if its gotta be done its gotta be done :).

p.s.my most humble gratitude for all help from everyone and i live for the day to return the favour.

[TK.]

I never tried the Kawai driver by myself, another user noticed that the Yamaha and Roland driver don't work with his windows installation, but the Kawai did run... however, I'm using Windows ME (and don't plan to switch to any newer version ;-)) therefore I cannot help if the failure is caused by a driver issue.

Rx pin: yes, you can disconnect this directly on J11, this should help. It's only important to know if the continuous stream is caused by a feedback loop, and this can be determined by "breaking" the loop.

Best Regards, Thorsten.

[Guest psytron]

tk you champ

every 2 sec i get "F0 00 00 7E 40 00 F7"

so i guess i probably have a problem with my ltc module

where the rx and tx are possably shorted.

i will be at it straight away with hopefully the nuts and bolts of it. :) .

i am on the right track i think (tell me if i aint)

beamin concentraighted good carma your way tk :)

Psytron

[Guest psytron]

i cannot seem to find any shorts on the ltc module.

i thought it may have something to do with the midi thru so i removed both the74hc00 still the same stream of data (with j11 on core intact).

other interesting info ( i hooked up the leds in/out)

when j11 intact:- both leds continualy on

with j11 dissconected on pin closest to gnd :- both leds light up for approx 1/2 sec every 2 sec. both light up at the same time.

i would have thought that with j11 broken only the out led should light up i think this narrows it down hopefully

[Guest psytron]

:D  yay problem fixed   :D

somehow i managed not to find a hair like solder bridge on the d connector on the ltc.

even after many hors with the multimetre and a magnifying glass.must have over looked that one hehe.

i was also having problems with the serial driver on my xp pc. the feedback loop problem would continue when i opened midiox.

mooved everything to an old p2 400 running win me

loaded mios1.2

and recieved your happy msg on my lcd screen (i split my lips grinning to fiercly) ;D

loaded an 8 pot version of ain example 3

connected my ain (with 8 pots)

switched on twisted my nobs and sweeeeeeet. led blinks lcd stated position of the knob it worked for them all.

hooked up to my pc (win me) opened up midiox

switched on, twisted a knob hmmmm :-/

midiox seems to take my values as a switch not as a fader i only get 2 msgs right at the start of travel.

is this normal ???

[Guest psytron]

more problems ???

hehe i believe the serial driver i have been using is crap at least for me it is .

as i said b4 when my mb is plugged in thu com port and midiox is runnin sometimes i get no msg and the sign on my lcd is changed from a "o" to a "*"  i guess this means it is looked at as a button or has something to do with the mode of the pot??

so i scratched the idea of using the rs232 method

and got myself a 15pin d connector and hooked it up to my game/midi port.

hmm  wrong baud rate i guess

re burnt pic to use normal midi baud rate (removed the 100 and replaced with 000 in config/id)

opened up midiox then tried to ul mios1.2  it failed to write and during the middle of the ul mb still kept sending "F0 00 00 7E 40 00 01 F7" every 2 secs.

i noticed that this was not happening when the ul worked.

the connections were all good as far as i could check with a mm.

i guess that the prob is with the pc/gameport side of things i had a quick fiddle with controlpanells it all seemed good. have i missed something small and dumb ass that is blatently obvoiuse?

if i dont figur it out in a few days i will start a new thread so others if they come across this prob can find it.

note i aint got no 220 ohm resistor (gameport to mb)

i tried 200 and 330 ohm with no success but am i right in thinking this should not be the issue?

(mm on volts says 5.1v between gnd and tx rx pins when midiox is running)

P.S. is it possable to change baud rate without using the jdm to me it seems not possable?

[TK.]

Ok, switching to the Gameport.... no, it isn't possible to change the default baudrate without reburning the PIC, it can be changed from the Application, but since the upload doesn't work.... however - now it's maybe better if you would check the Rx/Tx line of your Gameport first just to ensure that MIDI-Ox has been configured correctly.

Desolder the MIDIbox connections from the Gameport plug and solder the Tx pin to the Rx pin so that you have a feedback loop. Start MIDI-Ox, send a MIDI-Event (e.g. with the virtual keyboard). You should see the outgoing as well as the incoming MIDI event on the screen. If not, please post your MIDI-Ox configuration here (the port setup) - and maybe also the SysEx configuration (hope that you've set the delay between two F7 to 750 ms?)

Best Regards, Thorsten.

[Guest psytron]

i got the feedback loop with msg in the output and the input.

my delay after F7 is 750ms.

[Guest psytron]

another piece of (hopfully) usefull info

i pulled out the max232 from my ltc and connected it WITH the mb to gameport in hope of being able to monitor (leds) what is going on.

here are the results:-

midiox open

         port mapping :- mpu-401

         port map objects :- channels

                                        system

                                        mpu-401

                                        midiox events

 do not automaticaly attatch inputs to outputs

sometimes when i switch on both light up othertimes only the out lights up.

when sending sysex file, "midi in" does not light up until halfway thru send and then it lights up for approx 1-2 sec and is off b4 sysex send has finished.

"midi out" keeps lighting up every 2 sec to coincide with "F0 00 00 7E 40 00 01 F7".

midiox open

         port mapping :- mpu-401

         port map objects :- channels

                                        system

                                        mpu-401

                                        midiox events

 yes automaticaly attatch inputs to outputs.

the same as above except "midi in" flashes once more at end of file.

gameport detatched from pc :-

"midi out" lights up every 2 sec as expected.

i hope this may help

[TK.]

The MPU401 input is still mapped to the MPU401 output, you have to delete this routing (right-click on the entry -> delete)

Best Regards, Thorsten.

[Guest psytron]

ok so i finaly got it working properly.

i think the problem was in my sound card...

both my pcs have an onboard soundcard (dont laugh) and both run on a c-media cm8738 which i found out today even tho one board is 5 years older than the other.

using an old isa 1994 sound blaster no problems.

i seem to be using exactly the same settings in midiox but with creative mpu-401 instead of cmedia with no probs at all.

i am not sure what you meant do you mean this

------------------------------

port mapping :- mpu-401   <- - - - - - --delete this one

    port map objects :- channels

          system

          mpu-401  <- - - - - - - - - - - - - --or this one

          midiox events

 do not automaticaly attatch inputs to outputs

-------------------------------

at the moment i am waiting for my soundcard to return from the manufacturer (blew it up in 2 months :( )

it is still only a cheep sb live 5.1 but i am hopeing to find?? a good sound da converter and have it external and stay digital till then.

P.S. thank you sooooooo much tk. i first come across your site b4 the mb64 seq was in action and have been looking to build a box since then and now my opportunity has come to fruition i am a very happy camper. ;D

[TK.]

Fine that you finally found the reason :)

The lower MPU401 entry should be removed - this is the input port.

Best Regards, Thorsten.

[Steven_C]

both my pcs have an onboard soundcard (dont laugh)

I'm not laughing... Many modern consumer soundcards are amazing value for money! even the sblive is reasonable in my opinion... (though can be unreliable) not the highest quality, but still amazing compared to recording technology available to consumers a few years ago. Some people also bag out the onboard mac soundcard, but I reckon mine is sweet, I also have a very nice inca88 pci soundcard, very low noise despite no shielding on an internal card! And I have had the pleasure of hearing some really nice gear since I have been doing a recording/engineering course. Yes, I love to throw my own 2cents in sometimes! get it off my chest!

glad to hear its going well!

...Steve