D203 Posted August 13, 2012 Report Share Posted August 13, 2012 (edited) Silly question maybe, but is it possible to implement the V4 Lite with a pic-based core? I've been reading around ucapps and still don't fully comprehend all the capabilities of the different projects, but I'd love to make a lower cost V4L if doable (as you know - the LPCEXPRESSO in the U.S. tacks on another $25 or so). Thanks in advance for any advice... Edited August 13, 2012 by D203 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ilmenator Posted August 13, 2012 Report Share Posted August 13, 2012 No, this is not possible without advanced programming skills. If you really want to go PIC then look at SEQ V3 instead. However, your argument about the added cost of US$ 25 is not really a valid one. Compared to other parts necessary, especially the enclosure, this is negligible! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
D203 Posted August 13, 2012 Author Report Share Posted August 13, 2012 No, this is not possible without advanced programming skills. If you really want to go PIC then look at SEQ V3 instead. However, your argument about the added cost of US$ 25 is not really a valid one. Compared to other parts necessary, especially the enclosure, this is negligible! Aha, thanks. As blasphemous as it may be, I was considering a "thrift store find" enclosure (a briefcase or some other about-to-be-detritus). Corners would not have been cut on hardware however (buttons, etc.). The goal being: even lower cost and accessible to more people. The CORE8 kit in SmashTV's shop is $29.95. Alternately, the LPC17 parts kit is $27, + $17 for the PCB, and then you need to purchase the LPC Expresso at $26.25 - so using the CORE8 saves over 40 bucks, and depending on your salary that might not be negiligible (a week's worth of groceries). That said, now I'm sounding cheap! Really I just had to ask, and I should say it's not like it's not worth the extra $40. Seems like it might be worthwhile to save the money and use the CORE8 as an advanced programming learning tool, possibly developing some cool new stuff in the process, and it'd be worthwhile to spend the money and build a device as cool as the V4L as well. Anyway, thanks ilmenator. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
smashtv Posted August 13, 2012 Report Share Posted August 13, 2012 Aha, thanks. As blasphemous as it may be, I was considering a "thrift store find" enclosure (a briefcase or some other about-to-be-detritus). Not at all.... some of the best builds I have seen are in recycled enclosures. :thumbsup: Corners would not have been cut on hardware however (buttons, etc.). The goal being: even lower cost and accessible to more people. The CORE8 kit in SmashTV's shop is $29.95. Alternately, the LPC17 parts kit is $27, + $17 for the PCB, and then you need to purchase the LPC Expresso at $26.25 - so using the CORE8 saves over 40 bucks, and depending on your salary that might not be negiligible (a week's worth of groceries). $11 for the LPC core PCB only - $17 for PCB and MagJack. I realize that $27 for the parts kit causes some sticker shock, simply put quality parts and local lot testing costs more. Too many years as a tech replacing junk parts in otherwise good designs taught me the value of a verifiable supply chain. Quality fade afflicted connector plating and inferior capacitor catalyst might be acceptable for mass produced disposable junktronics, but I want these kits to live through tour use and work as expected when you pull it off the shelf 15 years later to show your kid/grandkid. :) Best regards Tim Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ilmenator Posted August 13, 2012 Report Share Posted August 13, 2012 That said, now I'm sounding cheap! Really I just had to ask, and I should say it's not like it's not worth the extra $40. Seems like it might be worthwhile to save the money and use the CORE8 as an advanced programming learning tool, possibly developing some cool new stuff in the process, and it'd be worthwhile to spend the money and build a device as cool as the V4L as well. Don't worry, you're not. The thing is just that a lot of people simply ignore those not so obvious costs and end up paying a lot more in the end than they had anticipated - or they never finish the project. I agree that you can save decent money when you recycle enclosures, though - and yes, if you don't consider the added time you spend when building your own enclosure, and not having a panel or case made somewhere, then 40 bucks could make a real difference. However, if you try to translate that saving into development time for implementing something like the SEQ V4L on the PIC... well, I guess you get the idea :twitch:. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
D203 Posted August 14, 2012 Author Report Share Posted August 14, 2012 (edited) $11 for the LPC core PCB only - $17 for PCB and MagJack. Ah! Correct. Apologies for the omission there, it was purely unintentional. I realize that $27 for the parts kit causes some sticker shock, simply put quality parts and local lot testing costs more. Too many years as a tech replacing junk parts in otherwise good designs taught me the value of a verifiable supply chain. Quality fade afflicted connector plating and inferior capacitor catalyst might be acceptable for mass produced disposable junktronics, but I want these kits to live through tour use and work as expected when you pull it off the shelf 15 years later to show your kid/grandkid. :) I agree with this 100% and I think your prices are quite reasonable actually. It wouldn't make any sense to build such killer hardware with poor quality parts. Your tour use and kid comments really tugged at me - from what I can tell this hardware is uniquely fantastic and it absolutely makes sense to build it with as much care as possible - and I do have a little boy who will be curious about it someday. :) As low cost as it all is already, I was daydreaming of possibilities for opening up the hardware to even lower cost experimentation. Around $30 for an advanced arpeggiator and/or looper/echo etc. would be an unbelievable deal and wouldn't be a hit to even some of the most modest wallets. Sill considering and wondering about those possibilities, but I've been obsessing about the V4L for at least 2 months now and every day I lean a little closer to it... Edited August 14, 2012 by D203 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
D203 Posted August 14, 2012 Author Report Share Posted August 14, 2012 Don't worry, you're not. The thing is just that a lot of people simply ignore those not so obvious costs and end up paying a lot more in the end than they had anticipated - or they never finish the project. I agree that you can save decent money when you recycle enclosures, though - and yes, if you don't consider the added time you spend when building your own enclosure, and not having a panel or case made somewhere, then 40 bucks could make a real difference. However, if you try to translate that saving into development time for implementing something like the SEQ V4L on the PIC... well, I guess you get the idea :twitch:. Gawd man, and there's such a long list of stuff I'd like to spend time on! It seemed like it might not be too difficult, although like I said I'm still wrestling w/ some concepts that are probably pretty basic to midibox-experienced folks. Somewhat off-subject, but just to provide context for my daydreams for the past few months - I've been using Atari ST software and I found my way to UCApps through that with thoughts like "if I could just build hardware that does some of the looping/algorithmic/fill/echo/randomizing stuff that RealTime and M do... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Duggle Posted August 15, 2012 Report Share Posted August 15, 2012 My advice, (if you're really serious), is to somehow find a way, even over time, to obtain the $40 extra and go with the 32bit core. The difference between the old (8 bit PIC)and new (cortex m3) is like night and day. No comparison. *Much* more fun to develop on (and play with) and, as is said, "in a different league".... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
D203 Posted August 18, 2012 Author Report Share Posted August 18, 2012 My advice, (if you're really serious), is to somehow find a way, even over time, to obtain the $40 extra and go with the 32bit core. The difference between the old (8 bit PIC)and new (cortex m3) is like night and day. No comparison. *Much* more fun to develop on (and play with) and, as is said, "in a different league".... Thanks Duggle, pretty positive after the informed feedback that I'll head in that direction. Questions, maybe you can help: the SEQV4L is capable of doing odd time signatures, right? I read somewhere that it was limited to 4/4, but that doesn't seem like it would be right. TK also mentions in the main SEQV4L post that it's capable of being controlled with a midi keyboard in lieu of the button/LED/PCB build - is there documentation somewhere that would help explain implementing this possibility? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
D203 Posted August 18, 2012 Author Report Share Posted August 18, 2012 Nevermind! Got my answers. <-- (forum searching is a good idea) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Duggle Posted August 19, 2012 Report Share Posted August 19, 2012 I've ordered a control panel pcb and am looking forward to building this myself.From my reading so far, a sequence can have up to 64 steps (4 bars of 4/4) but if you wanted e.g 2 bars of 7/8 you would select 28steps for the sequence. In this way a rather large gamut of time signatures/bars combo's is possible. Certainly the SEQ's have midi mapped control functions, I'd be surprised if SEQ4L does not have it already. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
D203 Posted August 22, 2012 Author Report Share Posted August 22, 2012 (edited) Thanks man. Updates here when I get this thing going. Updates in 5/4 maybe. :) OH... since you sound knowledgeable Re: MIDI-mapping - is this something I set in MIOS? Ie; I specify a key on my keyboard in MIOS (same keyboard I'm recording with), and when I play that key it sets the keyboard to SEQ "control mode" where I can control different parameters/effects? I'll search the forum for an answer to this when I get a chance, or if you answer sooner I'll read that, or maybe I'll d'l MIOS and mess around w/ it sans hardware, or maybe I'll ask more questions that have probably been asked a billion times, or all of the above... Edited August 22, 2012 by D203 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Duggle Posted August 22, 2012 Report Share Posted August 22, 2012 If you load the SEQV4 firmware into your core you can play with it. From memory you hold down a special key with other keys to issue action on the seq. IIRC its documented in uCApps or in the source code. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
D203 Posted August 24, 2012 Author Report Share Posted August 24, 2012 If you load the SEQV4 firmware into your core you can play with it. From memory you hold down a special key with other keys to issue action on the seq. IIRC its documented in uCApps or in the source code. Cool, I'll search around, thankya. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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