killerfrog Posted March 23, 2007 Report Share Posted March 23, 2007 Edit : dont take the time to read this thread, no solution has been found. Sorry ! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stryd_one Posted March 23, 2007 Report Share Posted March 23, 2007 I can't find where it has been installed and I don't know which program to use to see if it worksYou can see it in the device manager, and test it with MIOS Studio :) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lall Posted March 23, 2007 Report Share Posted March 23, 2007 Hi Killerfrog,While I was trying to find back some eval package on the Cypress website, I indeed read that they do not advice the AN2131 for new designs. So it's just a question of time before it's completely phased-out...Best regards,Lall Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
killerfrog Posted March 23, 2007 Author Report Share Posted March 23, 2007 that's cool. Here on this forum people really take time to read !!If I go foward in my idea, I would ask if anyone would have try to put the midinator code in a PIC18f2455 (or another that may be compatible ?) who may confirm it works or not ?How can I get the version of my Pic ? Is it by using the pickit starter 2 ?You were right about the device in Windows. Its appear when plugged under name (or in audio of windows under section hardware) : "périphérique audio USB"Fabricant : USB Audio GénériqueEmplacement : Emplacement 0 (Pic18F2455 MIDI V2.1)État du périphérique : Ce périphérique fonctionne correctementIf I translate a little bit, it would say that everything works fine!I join 3 pictures to show what I have, but I'm not sure it is detected by MIOS studio, is it ?Thank up to know for fast answers and handfull help !1.GIF2.GIF3.GIF Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stryd_one Posted March 23, 2007 Report Share Posted March 23, 2007 I join 3 pictures to show what I have, but I'm not sure it is detected by MIOS studio, is it ?It's installed, but apparently not as a midi device :/ I've always avoided USB MIDI, so I don't think I can help much here :( Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
killerfrog Posted March 23, 2007 Author Report Share Posted March 23, 2007 I see...Do you think this could have something to do with the silicon bug, or that's a bug with code itself ?Thank youP.S. Mabye someone has tried it so may have more information ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lall Posted March 23, 2007 Report Share Posted March 23, 2007 I'm not really a pro of the USB MIDI but normally the MIDI is a kind of sub-part of the USB audio class. Maybe if something goes wrong at some stage, Windows gets stuck thinking it's an audio interface...Do you see this audio interface in the list of your second window (i.e. where you show that there's no MIDI selection possible)? If Windows thinks it's an audio interface, logically you should see it in the possible audio devices.Best regards,Lall Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
killerfrog Posted March 23, 2007 Author Report Share Posted March 23, 2007 the only places where I found it I've have put in in those printscreens. It is no where else (at least that I think of).Other idea ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stryd_one Posted March 23, 2007 Report Share Posted March 23, 2007 Funny I was thinking that too Lall.killerfrog: In the second screenshot, there are three drop-down list boxes. The top one says 'Lecture Audio', and the item selected is currently 'SigmaTel Audio'.What other items are available in that list? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lall Posted March 23, 2007 Report Share Posted March 23, 2007 What version of Windows are you running?I know for sure that Windows98 does not support USB MIDI and that XP supports it.But I'm wondering if for example Windows2000 supports it or not. M$ website is not that clear on the subject but it gives me the impression that it does not support it. Maybe someone who has used the MBHP USB MIDI module with Windows 2000 can comment on this one...Best regards,Lall Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jidis Posted March 23, 2007 Report Share Posted March 23, 2007 they do not advice the AN2131 for new designs. So it's just a question of time before it's completely phased-out...FWIW, I inquired about that chip to Digikey a while back and they listed a "replacement" as being a:CY7C64713-56LFXC (Digikey part# 428-1680-nd, I think)I remember looking at it and it was a totally different package or something, but maybe someone more knowledgeable here would know if it's useful for anything.George Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lall Posted March 23, 2007 Report Share Posted March 23, 2007 Hi Jidis,They look pretty similar in a way at least only after 2 minutes read-through the application note an to EZ-USB FX1 ;)The good point is that it contains more internal RAM. The EZ-USB was pretty limited to that respect if you want to do something a bit more complex without spending ages on optimization.An inbetween point is the reduction of the number of endpoints. If I understand correctly, one need more endpoints when creating a composite device (e.g. a device that behaves at the same time as a mouse and as the same time as a MIDI interface). On the other hand, as long as you make only a MIDI interface with it, it does not really matter...A bad point I see is the new packages they are using. They are less DIY-oriented than before. The EZ-USB was already a bit small but the new EZ-USB FX1 are even smaller.One thing to really watch out is to avoid the CY7C64713-56LFXC that Digikey mentioned as it's apparently a QFN package. That's even worse than the small TQFP they propose as in QFN the pins are more or less under the chip! On the other hand, I believe almost all new chips we can find will have the same issue of using TQFP like pacakges.For the code, it looks like if you were not using too many specific things of the EZ-USB, converting to the EZ-USB FX1 should be doable in a reasonable amount of time even though a more detailed look should be taken to confirm that statement...Best regards,Lall Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
killerfrog Posted March 23, 2007 Author Report Share Posted March 23, 2007 Funny I was thinking that too Lall.killerfrog: In the second screenshot, there are three drop-down list boxes. The top one says 'Lecture Audio', and the item selected is currently 'SigmaTel Audio'.What other items are available in that list?Maybe I have not expressed myself clearly (probably because of language barrier). There is nothig else than "SigmaTel Audio" that appears there. In fact, SigmaTel Audio is my supposed Sound Blaster chip I've paid for when I have ordered my Inspiron 9400...I ask again a question I've have asked before; what is the way to know wich version of PIC18F2455 I have ?At least it seems there is another solution comming out as "EZ-USB FX1" proposed by Lall, but the PIC version seems to be so more simple to build and to use! (at least if it can work at all !) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lall Posted March 23, 2007 Report Share Posted March 23, 2007 The PIC looks indeed simpler but here's a post from TK I found back on the EUSART bug issue:http://www.midibox.org/forum/index.php?topic=3628.msg27266#msg27266I'm not enough into PICs to know if it applies to the one you're using or not.Concerning your problem, what version of Windows are you using? 2000 or XP?Best regards,Lall Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
killerfrog Posted March 23, 2007 Author Report Share Posted March 23, 2007 The PIC looks indeed simpler but here's a post from TK I found back on the EUSART bug issue:http://www.midibox.org/forum/index.php?topic=3628.msg27266#msg27266I'm not enough into PICs to know if it applies to the one you're using or not.Concerning your problem, what version of Windows are you using? 2000 or XP?Best regards,LallYes, I'M aware of that bug (I've called this bug the Silicon bug in 2 or 3 other posts in this topic by using the same name the owner of this website has given to it !). Thank you. That's the reason why I ask How I can get the revision version of my pic.My Windows is Win XP. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lall Posted March 23, 2007 Report Share Posted March 23, 2007 Hi,OK, sorry for repeating what you already knew, indeed you were using the same terms as used here :-[Actually, I was a bit under the impression that the bug was supposed to have disappeared at some point but then was back again a bit later. But honestly I'm no pro in the PICs so I may well be confusing different PICs, there are so many variants that I'm getting a bit lost...Best regards,Lall Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
killerfrog Posted March 23, 2007 Author Report Share Posted March 23, 2007 So am I !!In fac, I never has used PIC before this week. So I don't know a lot about them. I just wanted to do this for fun, but I found it is much more harder than a plug and play device...At least, according to what I think of that bug that apply to transmition, this should have nothing to do with the detection or not in Windows XP : I mean that even if data would not pass (with this revision of the PIC, but not with the A0, A1 or A2 (mabye A4 ?)), there shouldn't be any reason for the device to not beeing detected by Windows... or at least to not be completely on hands for the user... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lall Posted March 23, 2007 Report Share Posted March 23, 2007 I think you're right, that bug should not affect the way Windows recognizes the device.It should only affect the MIDI data you would send out using the UART.The strange thing is that Windows recognizes your device and gives its name from the descriptors so the transmission must happen in a way or another but at the same time something must be missing or must be wrongly interpreted to allow Windows to know that it's a MIDI interface and not only a generic USB audio thing.That's smelling the hours of debug I fear...Best regards,Lall Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
killerfrog Posted March 23, 2007 Author Report Share Posted March 23, 2007 i'm going to see a friend for the next hours wish is more skill in pics, Midi and have more Hadware to test than I have. I'll put some more infos in if we find something during this time.If someone else would have infos of any sort, that would be nice to share !Thank you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lylehaze Posted March 24, 2007 Report Share Posted March 24, 2007 I can offer a bit of information. I wrote a USB driver for class compatible interfaces, though not for Windows.To qualify as "Class Compatible", and be recognized by the built-in USB MIDI drivers, a device must identify itself asCLASS 0x01 (meaning Audio) andSUBCLASS 0x03 (meaning MIDISTREAMING)Unless both of these match, it will not be handled with the builtin USB MIDI device driver.I don't know much about windows, I avoid it as much as i can, but any decent USB sniffer should be able to give you the class and subclass of any device.Good Luck,LyleHaze Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
killerfrog Posted March 25, 2007 Author Report Share Posted March 25, 2007 just to give a little update, My friend and me have started to test the circuit on his computer with an professionnal audio card and professionnal software (Sonar 4) and it seems to be detected same way that it was with my comp (http://www.midibox.org/forum/index.php?topic=8817.msg62252#msg62252) with the diff that it appears in Sonar 4. During we were starting to test on his computer, he had a crash and memory failure (socket itself, not the memory !!) and we had to stop. So up to now I can't confirm it works, but with the brief tests we took, it seems to be in the good way.I must say that even if I install Sonar 4 on my comp, the Midi card doesn't appear for me... that's wreid...Can someone explain me how go get the pic revision version (to know right know if we are subject to the silicon bug or not) ?Is there anyone who would test the circuit in // with us to concure on inconcure ?Thank you Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
killerfrog Posted March 25, 2007 Author Report Share Posted March 25, 2007 I can offer a bit of information. I wrote a USB driver for class compatible interfaces, though not for Windows.To qualify as "Class Compatible", and be recognized by the built-in USB MIDI drivers, a device must identify itself asCLASS 0x01 (meaning Audio) andSUBCLASS 0x03 (meaning MIDISTREAMING)Unless both of these match, it will not be handled with the builtin USB MIDI device driver.I don't know much about windows, I avoid it as much as i can, but any decent USB sniffer should be able to give you the class and subclass of any device.Good Luck,LyleHazethank you for this information. That part seems to be ok in the code... at least for my poor knowledge Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stryd_one Posted March 26, 2007 Report Share Posted March 26, 2007 I must say that even if I install Sonar 4 on my comp, the Midi card doesn't appear for me... that's wreid...Can someone explain me how go get the pic revision version (to know right know if we are subject to the silicon bug or not) ?The problem here is with Windows or maybe the driver on your PC... The visibility of the port to sonar, is secondary to the port appearing in windows, which it doesn't on your PC. Sonar, or MIOS studio, both get a list of available midi ports from windows. If it works OK on your friend's PC, it's probably not the midibox which is at fault.The EUSART bug does not effect the appearance of the device in windows either, only the data that is sent later on. There are no working revisions of the PIC.I think you'll find that formatting and reinstalling windows will sort this out. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
killerfrog Posted March 26, 2007 Author Report Share Posted March 26, 2007 The problem here is with Windows or maybe the driver on your PC... The visibility of the port to sonar, is secondary to the port appearing in windows, which it doesn't on your PC. Sonar, or MIOS studio, both get a list of available midi ports from windows. If it works OK on your friend's PC, it's probably not the midibox which is at fault.The EUSART bug does not effect the appearance of the device in windows either, only the data that is sent later on. There are no working revisions of the PIC.I think you'll find that formatting and reinstalling windows will sort this out.maybe you are right for the reinstallation. But, for the very little time we had on my friend's comp, it seems it was beeing display exactly the same way in his devices that it was on mine... that's why it's wreid... According to this post, there is at least one working version of the device (see post # 17) http://forum.microchip.com/tm.aspx?m=85120# Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stryd_one Posted March 26, 2007 Report Share Posted March 26, 2007 But, for the very little time we had on my friend's comp, it seems it was beeing display exactly the same way in his devices that it was on mine... In this post, in the second image down, there was no device in the list. You sure that was the same on his PC? Cause if Windows doesn't show it there, but Sonar sees it, that's unusual... IE theoretically impossible, because that window gets the list by using the same MMAPI call as sonar...According to this post, there is at least one working version of the device (see post # 17) http://forum.microchip.com/tm.aspx?m=85120#I thnk TK has since retracted that :( Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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