napierzaza Posted March 9, 2008 Report Share Posted March 9, 2008 1) Okay, taking the following two links:http://www.ucapps.de/midibox_fm/mbfm_frontpanel.gifhttp://www.ucapps.de/midibox_fm/mbfm_din_default.pdfDoes "CFG Button" on the Panel equal "shortcut" on the DIN board? I cannot find any input called "CFG button" So am at a loss. My panels does not appear to really be reacting properly and I am testing all the wiring.2) I have Detented encoders from Alps, I recompiled MIOS to be ENC TYPE 3, but when selecting instruments it sometimes just gets caught. Basically it just rolls through all the options until it reaches the end. Is there something I can do. My recompiled version, where all the encoders are type 3, is definitely a different MD5 than the provided .hex (and it uploaded fine). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TK. Posted March 9, 2008 Report Share Posted March 9, 2008 You are not really lost, because you can easily find out the pin assignment in the setup_*.asm file ;)Shortcut was the old name for CFG - I uploaded a new diagram to make this clearEncoder: looks like a wiring error (maybe ground terminal mixed with A or B line)My proposal: try out all three possible combinations if the datasheet doesn't make the connections clear enoughBest Regards, Thorsten. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
napierzaza Posted March 10, 2008 Author Report Share Posted March 10, 2008 Okay, thanks TK. My Encoder seems wired fine. Can you tell me what type of encoder mine is?PEC11-4220F-S0012-Rear Facing-24 detents-20mm shaft-Insulated Shaft-Switch-12 pulses per 360 degree rotationThere's a quadrature output table in the datasheethttp://www.bourns.com/pdfs/PEC16.pdfI tried to compare it to this imagehttp://www.ucapps.de/mios/mios_encoder_modes.gif Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
/tilted/ Posted March 10, 2008 Report Share Posted March 10, 2008 In your case, it seems the centre terminal is to go to GND.If you get the other two back-to-front, "all" that will happen is that the encoder will work the wrong way (ie, clockwise turn will decrement value/position)I'd be a little careful with your encoder, as the manufacturer does not recommend hand-soldering.So to be safe, you might prefer to swap wires at the DIN board, rather than at the encoder. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
napierzaza Posted March 10, 2008 Author Report Share Posted March 10, 2008 What? I didn't notice the soldering mention. Is this serious? I did the work a while ago so do not know how well I did it or what temp. I thought they were chiefly physical anyways. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
/tilted/ Posted March 10, 2008 Report Share Posted March 10, 2008 I'd say it is very unlikely that you could damage a rotary encoder by soldering it. However the spec sheet you linked to did mention it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
napierzaza Posted March 10, 2008 Author Report Share Posted March 10, 2008 Okay, but what encoder type should I be configuring in the asm? The default is #2 ( think) and I've also recompiled and tried 3, and it still doesn't work. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TK. Posted March 10, 2008 Report Share Posted March 10, 2008 Perhaps type #1?Best Regards, Thorsten. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
napierzaza Posted March 10, 2008 Author Report Share Posted March 10, 2008 Okay, I was hoping there was some way to tell on paper. :-\ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
/tilted/ Posted March 11, 2008 Report Share Posted March 11, 2008 your encoder type is DETENTEDIe, the second one on the uCApps page you linked to.The point TK is trying to make is not that you have wired your encoder badly, but rather that you have wired it wrong.By this we mean that while you might have a good strong physical connection, the connection is to the wrong pin on the DIN board.Now, we've established that the centre pin on your encoder goes to GND (Vss), now you may have the other two pins wired backward.I would also suggest you double check that your centre pin is to GND (vss), as i still think this is the real problem. If you connect one of your other pins to GND, and the centre and opposite pins to your DIN board, the encoder will seem to work, but only go in one direction, just as you described. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
napierzaza Posted March 11, 2008 Author Report Share Posted March 11, 2008 Thanks for the continued help.I understand that they're detented, but there are 3 types of detented encoder settingsOkay, well, I'm certain the center is ground, and that's how it's wired. But wouldn't it being backwards just make a right turn move left, and a left turn move right? Or is it some other crazier problem? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
napierzaza Posted March 11, 2008 Author Report Share Posted March 11, 2008 I reviewed the datasheet and have in fact wired them backwards. Is this an issue, or is it that everything is just going to move backwards? The Midibox FM sheet does not really differentiate between A and B so I'm still not sure. Like I said before it's not an issue of confusing the ground and data line, that's fine. But I have confused A & B. I'll try when I get home. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stryd_one Posted March 13, 2008 Report Share Posted March 13, 2008 Sorry man, you're about to go backwards. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
napierzaza Posted March 13, 2008 Author Report Share Posted March 13, 2008 Responses are becoming more and more cryptic! So far I've flashed all the 3 different type of detented encoders, and none of them work. Type 1 worked the least well as it just screamed with clicks without me touching it even.Thanks to my Midibox being very testy about accepting mios app uploads I'm becoming more and more frustrated with it. I should have just foregone the control surface in the firstplace. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stryd_one Posted March 14, 2008 Report Share Posted March 14, 2008 Sorry, I have been rushing my posts a bit.Uhm... the crazy encoder business, that sounds like it's something aside from the backwards wiring you mentioned. Stop trying to fix the encoders, forget that, and go back to the busted core. you've broken a golden rule of troubleshooting. What's that you ask? The thing I have been considering adding to my sig for the last few weeks. Now I've done it :) You broke #1 and 2 ;) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
napierzaza Posted March 14, 2008 Author Report Share Posted March 14, 2008 From what I can tell there's not much I can do about the core problem. I try to upload a hex, it reboots, but does not upload the file (I think it's not accepting it). I just keep trying until it works. I'm of the opinion that it's my MBHP USB but like I said, it's reliable at all other times (sending notes or receiving and upload request). What can I really check? There is one problem with it. That's that if my usb cable is attached, some of the LEDs of my CS remain on even after I turned off the unit's power. This is strange as I only have Mi, MO and VS connected between the units, so I'm guessing there's something fishy going on. Is it better if I just make my USB unit not powered by USB? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stryd_one Posted March 15, 2008 Report Share Posted March 15, 2008 From what I can tell there's not much I can do about the core problem. I try to upload a hex, it reboots, but does not upload the file (I think it's not accepting it). I just keep trying until it works.Man whatever's wrong with it may keep causing you trouble... It may not, too, but it's a good idea to eliminate the possibility ;) I know squat about the USB module so I'll let someone else field your questions, but ahhh... yeh it doesn't sound great. I'd certainly remove USB power. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
napierzaza Posted March 15, 2008 Author Report Share Posted March 15, 2008 Okay, well I did as you suggested. The USB module is now powered by the core. But it is still reluctant to receive the file for some reason. I get an upload request and the MIOS reboots when I ask, but it's still not accepting the file. Also, now that it is powered from the main power, the startup message is not received when I first start the unit (as the USB module must still be booting). No more LEDs left on, no change in uploading behaviour Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stryd_one Posted March 16, 2008 Report Share Posted March 16, 2008 Sorry, I thought you meant you were powering the core by USB... not sure about that, otherwise... I don't want to break the thing so I better let someone else field these questions... But not many people have built the USB module :( Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TK. Posted March 21, 2008 Report Share Posted March 21, 2008 Some USB lines are so noisy, that this can disturb the uC execution (or the MIDI data transfer). Therefore it makes sense to use Optocouplers at both MIDI In sides, and to crossconnect the MIDI IOs (instead of using the MBLink port)For MBFM this is recommented anyhow, as the USB noise could influence the Audio Outputs as well.Encoder: from the datasheet it looks like DETENTED2, doublechecking the connections is important. As already mentioned: there are only 3 combinations - sometimes it's faster just to try all of them before trying to solve the issue on a theoretically way based on the wrong assumptions... Another point (the reason why I proposed to try DETENTED1) - are you 100% sure, that this is the right datasheet for your encoder? If DETENTED1 would work better, I could immediately say: ok, you downloaded the wrong one... ;)Best Regards, Thorsten. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
napierzaza Posted March 22, 2008 Author Report Share Posted March 22, 2008 So far I have tried all the possible DETENTED types and they all behave negatively. 2 and 3 more or less behave the same and the 1 have not worked whatsoever (more spastic). At this point I really have no idea what I can do. Argh, it's unfortunate you say that, as I wired it not to... and I happened to fasten the USB module to the side of the casing. Hrmmm. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TK. Posted March 23, 2008 Report Share Posted March 23, 2008 Have you ever tried to check the encoder A/B->DIN pin connections with the MIDIO128 application like descriped here?It would be interesting, if two individual note events are sent (good), and if note values are toggling when the encoder is not moved (bad). Best Regards, Thorsten. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
napierzaza Posted March 24, 2008 Author Report Share Posted March 24, 2008 I saw that suggestion, and understand your recommendation (notes sent when not moved bad). However I don't really see what I can do IF IT IS doing that. And as of now I can't easily upload applications as I am still discussing the MMJ bugs with the developer. ...Uploaded Midi128 firmware via the Sysex Librarian and it just hangs on startup. It says "MIOS V1.9f © 2007 T.Klose" and just stays there forever. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TK. Posted March 24, 2008 Report Share Posted March 24, 2008 However I don't really see what I can do IF IT IS doing thatIf you notice this, I would spend some more time in thinking about the root cause, and give you some more individual troubleshooting tips.On the other hand: the upload issue should be solved first! It doesn't make much sense to analyse on symptoms which could be related to an incomplete firmware.Best Regards, Thorsten. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TK. Posted March 24, 2008 Report Share Posted March 24, 2008 Due to your other post, I found a nasty bug in the MBFM application!The encoder table wasn't located at the right address (0x0000 instead of 0x3280)The nasty thing: users who just updated the new firmware cannot regognize this bug (because the old encoder table won't be overwritten), and I haven't found it, because I'm using setup_mbfm_tk.hex instead of setup_mbfm_v1.hexThats the reason, why you noticed this issue first (I'm sorry about that!)Please update to midibox_fm_v1_1c.zipBest Regards, Thorsten. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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