Jidis

I'm waiting for this guy's stuff to make it's "magical reappearance"- http://stores.ebay.com/ORK-INC_W0QQssPageNameZviQ3asibQ3astoreviewQQtZkm He specializes in 10k and 50k linear pots, encoders, harmonicas, and wooden ladybugs. He used to have a bunch up at a time. I watched the first couple end with zero bids and then decided to jump in, but they had already drawn some attention. The quantities are absurd, like a box of 200, 800, or 1000 pots for 10 dollars. I wanted to get some and let people here buy the leftovers, but he was done with the 180 degree PCB mounts before I came to my senses. There's no way in hell that the buyers all needed a thousand pots for something, or that they all run electronics stores outside of eBay, so I'm predicting that in the near future, there will be small quantities of the pots showing up for auction and some very wealthy people planning for their early retirements. >:(                                      -George PS- I think he lists potentiometers as "encoders", but he's had some plastic shaft *actual* encoders as well. Â

I'm interested - Thanks! I grabbed some 4x4 LED's in plain (single light) red a while ago and would eventually like to figure out how to edit MB64 code for them, to cut back on the D.OUTs. I couldn't find much other than the SID code to learn with. I'm taking your stuff with me tonight to read over. Any additional comments you feel like adding to the source quotes on your site would be much appreciated. -George  PS--That's the coolest looking button panel I've seen in a while :D

Ed Roots, (looks like Raphael got in here while I was typing) Welcome! You can edit/save some on the box itself (with an LCD), but a lot of the hardware configuration,etc. will be done in the actual source code files for the application you've chosen, before you compile it and dump it into the chip. There's a lot of flexibility in it, but Thorsten has done a pretty good job of commenting the sections you'll want to edit in the code files. It's usually just a matter of changing some of the default numbers for your particular box and he tells you which ones do what. I'm not sure how much you already know, but you'll need to grab some free stuff (MPLAB) from Microchip's website to compile the app, if you're going to make some changes. You don't really need to know much about the compiler. The MPASM window is pretty straightforward and should run fine at it's defaults if you haven't made a big mess in the source files. The MIOS system can run a bunch of different applications. You can get the current MIOS code, as well as the application you're planning to use (MB64, I assume) into the box via MIDI after you've got it running, so if you want to edit MB64 source files afterward, you can just resend the new MB64 program to your box. The bootloader is the only thing that needs to be burned into the PIC to start with, but there's way more info and instructions on all that at the UCAPPS site. My main application is Nuendo, and I rarely have to leave it for audio/MIDI, but most audio programs now should be able to alter their own incoming map(s) to work with the MIDI controller and note messages you're sending them. Even with the default controller and note mappings from a MIDIBox, you should be able to link them to many of the software elements you'll be using, but you can also create custom patches and upload them or save them to banksticks.                            -Take Care George

Hi Moebius, That was one of the tests I was doing with the aluminum. I had some sections done with various grits of fine paper. I've wondered if "too fine" of a paper might make it harder for the toner to stick during the transfer. I think Gootee mentions something about the "micro-fine" scratches helping the PCB transfers. My tests were really sloppy and rushed, so I can't really say which worked the best. My heating procedure from one to the next was probably more different than the smoothness of the metal ;) They all did pretty well though. I've done lots of other stuff with clear lacquer top coats. It is some strong s**t. If you hit it with really carefully sprayed "mist" coats from a decent distance and let them dry in between, you'll usually be safe. After the first coat or two dries, it doesn't seem to have that risk of eating and blurring everything up. It will fuse into the top layer of what you spray it on if it's weak enough. There may actually be a less aggressive clear coating for what we want, but I'm not sure. Thanks for the front panel labelling link. I think I had it bookmarked, but hadn't seen it in a while. I wish he had done the exact same prints with different papers though. They all looked different (and great) anyway! BTW- Pulsar also makes that "toner reactive film" paper in green and white. That's for color and protection over raw toner. I've been meaning to get some, but I don't have any black stuff on the agenda right now. -GeorgeÂ

Just found this while looking for a datasheet- http://www.mitt-eget.com/displays/ It's got some downloadable CAD-style images of all different colors and styles of number displays. I wish I had seen it a couple weeks ago. I had to draw a bunch while working on my box layout :( -George

They come and go on eBay. It's a good deal if you don't like the prices of the new ones. They usually sell in a batch for cheap. I've gotten a few different kinds on there. This guy's got some cool ones and ships worldwide- Â Â Â http://tinyurl.com/7ngns He got me mine within a few days. Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â - Take Care

Hey again, I "tested" it on a few different materials, but PCB is the only thing I've done a lot of. It seemed anything smooth and flat was capable of taking the transfer, so I would say yes. It usually takes me a couple of messed up attempts to arrive at the ideal amount of heat/pressure/time, even with the PCB's, if I haven't done one in a while. I've put stuff on a piece of dull gray steel, an aluminum sheet and even lexan/plexiglas (which melted after a while). I'd guess each substrate is going to have a slightly different technique depending on thickness and how they absorb heat. Most stuff can easily be wiped clean when you screw up :) IIRC, the aluminum took the longest time. I've been meaning to try heating from both sides to keep the metal hot, but haven't done it yet. Here's the page that turned me onto it, if you haven't already seen it- http://www.fullnet.com/u/tomg/gooteepc.htm George PS- I think you'd want to coat it with something afterward to protect it, but test it out and go light at first to keep from blurring the toner.

----BTW-> How many graduation "tick marks" usually go around a knob and where are the start/end points for most pots??

Me neither! Ramonster, I went looking for it and just found some here,- http://www.jejeprodukt.nl/docs-uk/jejeproducten/main.php but then I realized that it would put the clear paper on the panel along with my text. I'd have to see what it came out looking like first. There's always the "toner transfer" method. I've gotten quite good with that on PCB and metal, but my procedure usually requires one or two little spots or lines to be redrawn with a marker. I don't like the sound of that for a front panel.              Good Luck! -George PS- That's still the best DIY technique I've been able to find for what I want to do, so I'm trying to figure out if maybe I can do my labels in modular sections. That way, I could iron-on a section at a time, and wipe each one off and try again if I hadn't gotten a perfect transfer. It's just going to be a hassle trying to protect the finished sections while I move to the next. Â

Hey everybody! I've sort of buried myself with projects and obligations lately and haven't been able to get in here much or work on my MIOS learning :'( I hate to bring this back up, but number9's post reminded me of a request for an ability to control MIOS's "current pot" value with select buttons (I think this is the right thread)- http://www.midibox.org/forum/index.php?topic=5146.0 I was coincidentally thinking of something recently, very similar to number9's, but 'with' multiple control destinations for the knob. It would also require the "current pot select" function. Say, if you wanted to map out a nice large mixer or parametric EQ's layout in your box, but didn't like the idea of snap mode and fixed knob indicators which wouldn't always be displaying the correct settings, and you weren't ready to tackle a whole panel full of encoders/led rings and the circuitry they would require- You could lay out a whole panel's worth of control parameters, with either an icon, a label, or an erasable scribble strip, with an LED indicator somewhere near the label, and one or more "navigation" buttons to get you from knob to knob. Best case would be lights *beneath* the icons or labels on translucent plastic or something. As you tapped around from knob to knob, the lights would change in sequence to show which item you were controlling. You could then have one nice big knob like number9 wants, with a meter bar, an LED ring, or just the LCD volume bar page to show you the value and/or parameter's name. For a small mixer or something, you could get 20 channels or more in one rackspace with a medium sized knob on an encoder. You could also probably squeeze lighted mute/solo buttons in for each channel, if you cut back the number of channels. You'd probably only have one "pot type thing" to try to mount, and an easy line of holes to drill for some LEDs. Despite the simplicity of it's construction, it would be powerful as crap and should be very quick to move around on. I hate to sound lazy, I'm just still in the "caveman era" of my MIOS editing skill. I tinkered with accessing the current pot variable and with that multi-value button output idea that myself and some others were requesting a little while ago, but I made more mess than progress. I managed to get to a bunch of those areas and make changes, but there were always other parts of the source that they crashed into or which didn't acknowledge my edit >:( I have a feeling this "knob select" button code would be a walk in the park for some of the assembler veterans in here. I'll have to get back on it if nobody else does. (I'm dreaming of a MIDIBox parametric)                          - Take Care George Â

Artesia (or anyone here), I couldn't help but notice these are common cathode. Is this any problem for the LED part of the MIOS code or circuits, other than just rearranging some of the wiring? I've seen a bunch of CC's that I liked, but was afraid to get ;) -George

1truewheel, If you are still having trouble with this, please post some details. Myself, or someone else here may be able to explain the schematic connections while Thorsten is gone. - Good Luck! George

Still wondering on the D.IN part-- My pin connections are indeed 6,5,4,3,11,12,13,14, which was what it "looked like" in the schematic. I'm guessing they were supposed to have been 6,5,4,3,14,13,12,11 and the original schematic, with the D.In and D.Out circuits on one page, is even a different numbering. 6->3 then 11->14 was what I was supposed to have done right? Also, how much hassle is it to reverse their order within the software? BTW-- This is just a test board, and the first 20 tactile button's connections are easy to get to and change. The next twelve are sort of trapped under a keypad (unless I can maybe change them right at the shift registers). Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â -Thanks!

Got this sorted tonight. :) I guess I was a bit more sloppy on the soldering than I thought. I had a couple LED legs that didn't make a good connection to the traces, and a 595 power pin which did the same. :o I think I do have the second half of every multiplexor going down instead of up, but I haven't decided if I care yet. -George

pay_c Yeah, I had it in-line with the supply. I think this one does 200milli down to 200micro amps, if that sounds likely.(?) Maybe I was overrange. I still get some decent heat on this one, after it's been on for a while. I may try to check the amperage again if that's not normal, or bump down to a smaller input supply. I brought my other 40x2's back from the studio tonight. I think this one is indeed "toast". :-[ Funny thing, I ran it all through my initial temporary setups with hot irons and crossed wires and junk all over the table, and then bring it home and mount it to a nice clean board and I end up cooking it. ;D I shouldn't feel bad. I got it with two other brand new ones on eBay a while back for 9.95 USD. I didn't even realize that was a good deal at the time. -GeorgeÂ

Hey again, I've got a nice test board together now, with a bunch of i/o on it. I dumped that dout app into the core with 32 LED's and 32 buttons. I'm getting weird dout signals on my LED's though. There are a couple in the first 8 which don't light, and I don't think I got any activity from the 9th light on. It's probably just a connection that I broke loose while screwing the boards down. The light board will be pretty easy to remove and check, I'm just looking for confirmation that the LED sequence should go 1-32 (or last). I tried it first with the original main file, and then cut it down to SRIO# =4. I checked all the connections when I made the board, along with the serial links between chips, the pull up connections and resistances. I'll check it again. My three register 8 digit display seems fine on that same output. My buttons appear sort of screwy on the d.in too, like every couple rows are reversed. The 1-8 numbering I used for the 4051's was pins 6,5,4,3,11,12,13,14. I'm guessing one of those groups of four is backwards. There's plenty of space on the bottom of that for re-jumping the lines, but it probably doesn't matter on that one. I just needed the quantity. Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â - Thanks! George

For those interested. Just saw the announcement in a newsgroup. http://www.opera.com/ -George

pay c- Thanks! I did eventually get the second core working, so I'll check the other later when I've got time. Between the two, I think I've made every careless mistake there was to make, and desoldered/resoldered and replaced components before finding whatever stupid thing it was that I did. For the grand finale on that first core, I replaced the rectifier with four power diodes, and while checking some voltages, I managed to short two of the wires from the diode jumble, and got a nice "burnt stink" smell. The PIC survived, but I think I zapped one of my 40x2's. :'( I now get a screen of two rows of solid black squares, and if I wait a few seconds, a blank hole starts to burn through it like the intro to Bonanza. It then spreads throughout the screen and wipes all the squares. I should've used a 2x16 until I got everything straight. The new one is definitely working now, and I've got the "LED digits" app spitting out an 8 segment LED display :) My meter, for some reason, wouldn't give me an amperage reading in series with the core power. I now have nice big heatsinks on both cores and will probably add one to my Greg, but I think with the boards and components all working right, the amperage and heat will be in the right range. I don't have many parts left to swap on that bad core, so I should hit the problem spot with a bit of tinkering. PS- The base of that transistor going through 1k to the wiper and to one side of the 10k pot on the schematic hits the third leg of the pot instead, on the core layout. I found a forum mention of a mismatch between the board/schematic in the luminance area. This is actually correct right? Also- Has anyone seen that "burning black squares" thing on an LCD? Is it most likely a lost cause now?             -George

FWIW- I never did get this straightened out. I think I've checked just about every connection and replaced about 80% of the parts. There's a new 2200uF cap, a new regulator, a new 3904 and 4001(?) diodes in place of the rectifier. All the 5v pins seem to be getting a little over that (5.1 maybe). I think the opto has also been switched and there's two different PIC's being tried (they both verify and program well on the JDM). I also re-heated and checked all the PIC solder joints as Smash recommended, plus a few others. I couldn't find anything between 9v and 6v here, so I had to stick with a 9, but I figure there are a bunch of others using that here. The problem has gotten worse, but I've got a modified core board I'm going to finish at the studio tonight, so maybe that one will work OK. I remember a thread about crystals which don't start reliably. Is the faulty, black square LCD/no output messages behavior something you'd get from that? I haven't swapped the crystal yet.            -Take Care George

Thanks for the great tips guys! I did bring my multimeter home with me. I'll check the current. I'm pretty sure it is pulling too much. I was running a Greg board with the exact same core parts and I don't remember the startup problems, or all this heat. This regulator actually burned me last night :-X I'm pretty good about checking for shorts and continuity after etching, but as Smash mentioned, there is good possibility that there's a bad solder joint or something from the assembly. Smash, Speaking of test rigs, you'd like this one ;) -- 32- 5mm LED's with 4- 595's in banks of 8, on a board about 2.5"w x4.5" tall, 20- tactile buttons and a 12 key numeric keypad on a board about the same size horizontally with 165's on the back, 16- miniature 2" faders on a board about 2x5", a core board, a 2x40 display, a 1.5x5" 8 digit clock display with 3- 595's and a board with about 20 different single and dual pin headers and sockets, linked together in pairs with the two MIDI connectors and power jack on it for custom patching. All the i/o boards have 5 pin headers on them, except the faders, which have a ribbon (I still need to make a dual 4051 board for that one). All six boards and the LCD are mounted with rubber standoffs to a plywood panel (about 6" tall x 20" wide) at 45 degrees, in between my keyboard and monitor at home with my online computer. The standoffs give me enough room to run the cables under the boards if I want. I'm looking forward to using it for MIOS programming. The jumble of breadboard junk was causing me more problems than it was worth, and now I've got plenty of buttons and lights for testing. I'd like to get the JDM on there with an in-circuit programming hookup. I've had to pull these PIC's too many times now.                              - Take Care           George PS-- Those shift registers are still: pins 6,5,4,3,11,12,13,14 for 1-8 aren't they? :-[Â

Hi, I've got a core here which doesn't always boot correctly on the first attempt. Sometimes it comes on to the top row of black bars, and if I switch power off and back on quickly it inits properly. I thought I remembered someone mentioning a similar problem here, but I'm not sure. There's been a couple different AC/DC "wall-warts" involved, so I don't think that's the cause. The current one is putting out 9VAC at 850mA. The previous one was higher amperage with DC out. My 7805 heatsink is hot as crap, but I guess that's normal(?). I'm also swapping between two different 18f452's, when I screw one up, so I don't think it's the PIC, unless the new JDM is doing the same thing to both of them. I'm using the regular MBHP Core v2 board. Anything in particular to check? -Thanks!Â

I should mention that I got those light bars. If anyone's looking for some, stay away from these: They aren't actually the segmented bars like you usually see. They're more like a group of lights hiding behind a tinted lens. You can't really tell where one ends and the next one begins. I don't know what the crap they're for, maybe to create a "varying intensity" light or something. I might chain a bunch up to an LM3915 and see what it looks like in "dot mode".

Beat ya to it ;DÂ (the request, that is)Â ------>OOPS! (...just saw the date this was posted) http://www.midibox.org/forum/index.php?topic=5188.0 (edit#2)-- Just re-checked my post in assembler. Looks like the math was a bit funky ;) I guess it would be something more like "start at zero and add 127/(the divisor setting-1), then flip back after 127. I've already laid out my box design for that, but am not looking forward to the programming involved. I'm now working on a batch of 32 button, 32 LED, 16 fader boards, so I can start learning some MIOS at home and stop neglecting all my studio work. I also want to step through the "current pot" parameter with a button, but I think the output value steps would be the most useful, especially for multi-selection, non-continuous type parameters, like EQ filter types. If anyone has the time and knowhow, there's at least three of us now :) Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Take Care, George PS (Thorsten and all)- Whatever happened to the guy that was implementing shift key modifiers for the buttons? He sounded like he knew what he was doing. I wonder if it worked. I thought that would be cool too for maybe using the same batch of buttons for solo/mute/select, like on some of the commercial stuff.

I grabbed 10 of those eBay buttons when I posted that reply and they're already here :) If anybody is looking for something like Jack described you should check them out. They look cool as crap, but they're only in black (actually a really dark gray) and have either a green LED or a red one. The finger detent is nice and shallow and the rest of the face is flat, so you sort of press the whole button, LED and all. The switch pushes straight inward like a PC keyboard key switch, instead of tilting like the Digitast/E-Switches. The click feels nice and smooth. Jack- They have male and female pins on the sides, so they can lock side by side in a row and they're much smaller than they look in the picture. Two, side by side is only about .75" with barely any space between them (but they don't rub together). They're about .6" tall. I'm anxious to see the LED's tonight at the studio. I may get some more. You could get 16 lighted solo buttons into 6". I think some were for mains voltage or something. PS--- They *should be* N.O. - If not I'll post back. Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â - George

Just be glad you're not dealing with "used" ones, where the legs are already clipped ;) I've gone by the metal pieces inside as well, but I'm not sure if that's always the same. Remember there's also a flat side on some for the cathode. Here's another link: http://www.kpsec.freeuk.com/components/led.htm