MB-6582 - some issues with buttons and more

[jaans]

Hello everyone! I bought a used MB-6582 from this forum and received it just in time for Christmas. I've been having a really great time with it so far.

However, there are some issues. These might be stupid questions as I haven't built the device myself, but I have tried to study posts in this forum as well as the various guides and manuals and haven't found similar issues, so here goes:

- Some of the buttons don't seem to work. For example oscillator waveform button doesn´t work and filter section buttons don't work at all (except for the ext in button). I can change the values using the menu system but it would be great if the changes could be done using the buttons in the panel. All leds and encoders work, as do some of the buttons (for example LFO and all menu buttons work fine). I wonder why is this or have I missed some setting that enables those buttons or something..?

- Filter cutoff frequency value is shown in HEX in the menu. It also seems the cutoff is cut mostly when moving the value between 0 to 20%, and then only subtly in the rest of the value range. Is this normal?

- The main encoder used to change menu values etc. moves in steps (unlike other encoders), but the value moves independently from the steps (it seems the selection moves about ten values for every step). Is it possible to change this somehow so that the encoder would only move one value per step?

- The audio output jacks have been soldered too high for the rear panel I ordered to fit. You can see the issue in the attached image. In the guide it is suggested that no desoldering should be done on the PCB. I think only the seller probably knows this, but I am wondering if the audio output jacks used can even be re-soldered low enough, at least without doing some modifications? Maybe I should just order a new rear panel with audio output jack holes placed higher..?

Thank you in advance if anyone is willing to help a newbie or even point me to the manual if there is an answer to these issues :)

Edited December 25, 2010 by jaans

[JRock]

Sure you can resolder'em. If you don't bugger up the board. Measure'em first to make sure that if you go to all that trouble that it will definitely fit.

Merry Christmas :santa:

[jaans]

Thanks! I got in contact with the seller and already found out the probable reason for the button problem too. One of the wires had come loose. I think that I will not go through the trouble to resolder the outputs. I'll rather try to modify the rear panel somehow.

[phunk]

- Some of the buttons don't seem to work. For example oscillator waveform button doesn´t work and filter section buttons don't work at all (except for the ext in button). I can change the values using the menu system but it would be great if the changes could be done using the buttons in the panel. All leds and encoders work, as do some of the buttons (for example LFO and all menu buttons work fine). I wonder why is this or have I missed some setting that enables those buttons or something..?

sounds like bad solder joints. If so, resoldering is the only option. Other option would be a loose cable to the dins...

- Filter cutoff frequency value is shown in HEX in the menu. It also seems the cutoff is cut mostly when moving the value between 0 to 20%, and then only subtly in the rest of the value range. Is this normal?

Depends on the SIDs used.

- The main encoder used to change menu values etc. moves in steps (unlike other encoders), but the value moves independently from the steps (it seems the selection moves about ten values for every step). Is it possible to change this somehow so that the encoder would only move one value per step?

"moves in steps" = detended. Behaviour depends on the encoder used. There are differences in the number of steps hardwarewise.

- The audio output jacks have been soldered too high for the rear panel I ordered to fit. You can see the issue in the attached image. In the guide it is suggested that no desoldering should be done on the PCB. I think only the seller probably knows this, but I am wondering if the audio output jacks used can even be re-soldered low enough, at least without doing some modifications? Maybe I should just order a new rear panel with audio output jack holes placed higher..?

picture is so bad i cant recognize what you mean. Normally there is no wrong way of soldering audio jacks with a pre made pcb...they would not work. Ordering a wrong panel could be a reason though...

Edited December 25, 2010 by phunk

[jaans]

Thank you for the reply! Here are some comments..

sounds like bad solder joints. If so, resoldering is the only option. Other option would be a loose cable to the dins...

You are right, after closer inspection I found out that one wire had come loose. I think that after resoldering I have a good chance of fixing this issue.

Depends on the SIDs used.

Two of the SIDs are 6582's and two are 6581´s. The filter works better with 6582's (as expected), but on either one, it seems the change in the cutoff is not linear but mostly happens in the lower values. I think it sounds really nice anyway so it doesn't bother me that much.

picture is so bad i cant recognize what you mean. Normally there is no wrong way of soldering audio jacks with a pre made pcb...they would not work. Ordering a wrong panel could be a reason though...

Yes, the picture was bad, sorry. I attached a new picture.. This was also taken with a phone camera so apologies for the quality. But you should see that the audio output jacks are about 3-4 mm higher than the base of the pcb. This is because they have sort of "legs" that hold them onto the pcb. This also causes the issue that the standard MB-6582 rear panel doesn´t fit. I think I will try to drill new holes into the panel or something..

I am also doing a new case for the synth and the synth didn't come with a rear panel originally so that is why I ordered the standard panel to go with it.

Edited December 25, 2010 by jaans

[phunk]

Two of the SIDs are 6582's and two are 6581´s. The filter works better with 6582's (as expected), but on either one, it seems the change in the cutoff is not linear but mostly happens in the lower values. I think it sounds really nice anyway so it doesn't bother me that much.

Consider this "normal" then. :)

Yes, the picture was bad, sorry. I attached a new picture.. This was also taken with a phone camera so apologies for the quality. But you should see that the audio output jacks are about 3-4 mm higher than the base of the pcb. This is because they have sort of "legs" that hold them onto the pcb. This also causes the issue that the standard MB-6582 rear panel doesn´t fit. I think I will try to drill new holes into the panel or something..

Now i got it. The audiojacks used are "wrong" when applying the standard rear panel. An audiojack with thin solder legs is needed so the body sits flat on the pcb. The part used is very likely the reichelt standard audiojack with widened solder legs that cant be mounted flat but has a few mm clearance.

I´d recommend you desoldering them and use the right part. Thats way easier than reworking the perfectly made panel.

You should have some soldering experience though. Otherwise give it to a friend who has.

All you need is desoldering braid, new jacks and an soldering iron. 3 Minutes work.

[Flemming]

Two of the SIDs are 6582's and two are 6581´s. The filter works better with 6582's (as expected), but on either one, it seems the change in the cutoff is not linear but mostly happens in the lower values. I think it sounds really nice anyway so it doesn't bother me that much.

You are right that filters are different. If you look inside this packet of MBSID firmware (http://www.ucapps.de/mios/midibox_sid_v2_0_rc37.zip) you'll notice that there are different versions for 8585 (6582a) and 6581 - the mb6582 version is tuned for 6582a use, but it won't hurt to toy around with these, flashing one or two to see if filter response is affected. In the end i think you can flash the cores with separate firmwares to suit the SIDs.

I'm not awfully sure about this as i never had more than 1 working 6581 :tongue: I'm a 6582a/8580 guy myself, liking the filters a lot!

The hex readout is not a bug - it's a feature :D Congratulations on your nice xmas gift!

[Janis1279]

There are some default filter calibration value differences :

in the setup_6582.asm file :

; Individual Setup File for MB-6582

;; select default filter calibration value

;; expecting 12bit values (0..4095)

;; will be overwritten by ensemble setting - this is only used as default value for BankStick initialisation!

#define DEFAULT_FILTER_CALI_MIN 0

#define DEFAULT_FILTER_CALI_MAX 1536

and in the setup_6581.asm file :

; Prepared Setup File for 6581 SID

;; select default filter calibration value

;; expecting 12bit values (0..4095)

;; will be overwritten by ensemble setting - this is only used as default value for BankStick initialisation!

#define DEFAULT_FILTER_CALI_MIN 0

#define DEFAULT_FILTER_CALI_MAX 4095

I am not 100% sure about this.My MB 6582 project is far from this step yet. I have different Sid pairs ,too.

Regards,

Janis

[jaans]

Thank you to everyone for helping me so far!

I managed to fix the encoder problem - updating to MIOS 1.9g fixed it completely (MIOS 1.9f was installed previously). It seems after the update filter also got better. :)

However, I only updated the master core so far, but now I have run into a new problem! For some reason, after the update some leds and buttons stopped working. Now no leds in row 6 of the mod matrix work for some reason, also some of the buttons suddenly don´t work. The LFO button doesn't work and none of the menu buttons work either anymore which is quite bad.

Does anyone have any idea how the MIOS 1.9g update (+ MBSID 2.0 RC37 firmware) could have caused this and how could it be fixed?

Edited December 27, 2010 by jaans

[TK.]

The control surface of your MB-6582 will only run properly with the configuration of setup_6582.hex, please upload this file again.

There is no need to select another file just only for changing filter calibration values, as they can be configured in the ENS->FIL menu page (thereafter store the ensemble to make this change permanent)

And as a sidenote: the calibration values defined in the .asm files are only taken into account when a "virgin" BankStick will be formatted. Thereafter the values can only be changed in the ENS->FIL page anymore (or from external via SysEx, resp. Rutger's MBSID V2 Editor).

Best Regards, Thorsten.

[jaans]

I now uploaded setup_mb6582.hex (there was no setup_6582.hex) again, but the new issue with some of the leds and buttons unfortunately still remains.

I checked and there didn't seem to be any loose wires (and the leds and buttons worked fine before updating to MIOS 1.9g).

Before the update MIOS version was 1.9f and the MBSID firmware was same as now, 2.0 RC37. Any ideas, what should I try next..?

EDIT: Found the cause.. one wire was in fact broken again. Sorry to bother you with these "issues".. I'm sure after resoldering this problem will be fixed.

Edited December 27, 2010 by jaans

[Janis1279]

Hi, jaans

There are Wilbas schematic diagrams ( with the some minor mistakes , I found it when comparing diagrams with the setup_mb6582. asm file) for the CS pcboard wiring:

http://www.midibox.o..._din_wiring.pdf

http://www.midibox.o...dout_wiring.pdf

Thorsten, Thank You for your advice !

Regards,

Janis

Edited December 27, 2010 by Janis1279