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mex

MidBox SID Core Module schematic

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Hello all,

 

 

i am finally after 5 years coming to the point of trying to finish off my SID module :) Since i got a lot of nanoSIDs and now trying to build a full 10 SID chip device, yeah :)

 

I have a question, since, in my humble opinion, the documentation is quite not good, sorry to say so, but I am missing a lot of documentaiton on the schematics, for me the best of coourse would be to have some eagle pcbs files or at least double layed brd and sch files as gif or pdf, to controll all the values.

 

But what i am really missing big time is some real schematic of my mb6582 modules.

 

Here is my first question:

 

in each core module there is a Diode on Pin 35, it gives 5 V thru the pull up? R80 which should be 1k.

 

Where can i possibly find that in any schematic?

Or to put it another way, does anyone have a full schematic of the modular addict mb6582 PCBs?

 

 

Would appreciate any help, otherwise i will maybe continue to post my built process.

cheers,

seb

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Hi Seb - I too am building the MB6582 pcb from Modular addicts. I would love to see the schematic also, but I did some digging and found this:

http://ucapps.de/midibox_sid/mbsid_v2_communication.pdf

It shows the CAN bus between the four PICs. Unless I am in correct, this is what you are asking about.

Regards,

Justin

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Exactly, thanks a lot for the quick advice, I already thought about this a little.

 

Also interesting choice i think with the can, but I think those PICs ought to have a CAN bus module integrated.

 

Also I have to flash 4 new PICs for my built, maybe someone from Germany would like to help me out there, i dont yet own a Microchip programming tool, I know i can get one for 30€ but right now i will exclusively use it for the midibox sid built seems like a little overkill to buy one.

 

Feel free to post your newset builds and progresses, maybe I will too :)

 

Right now I build up the Core and SID module, i still have to solder all the pins and headers and then poer up the unit.

I choose PSU optionB, for 12V and 9V capability, strangely I do own 2 different PSUs form old C64, one has the required 9Vac and 5Vdc, the other one has only DC outputs, maybe from a newer C64 batch.

Cause i got 1 6582 ( 9V) and the nwer 8580 12 V if i am right, ah also a sidequestion, does anyone have a datasheet of the 8580 SID?? my basic research on the webs did only provide the 658x variants..?

 

The rest of the SIDs I do not own originals, but I got my self a batch of swinSID nanos, I will test them, they are suppose to be Atmel SID emulations, running on a single 5 V supply, direct replacement of the original SIDs, I am very looking forward how and if this all works, and which one sounds better, as I then got 3 different SID chips to test.

 

 

Ah also the front, I call it control PCB, is not populated yet, I want to test the hight of incremental rotaries and the buttons and LEDs first, havent decided yet what i am going to use, simple question here:

Do I have to use rotary knobs with switch ( the ones you can press) on the PCB it seems that you can or must use those, probably you can activate something in the menu later by clikcing it, but somehow i did end up ordering the things without the switch, maybe I did read something about this somewhere, the project is rotting in my place for quite a bit now :)

 

Thanks for reading.

 

 

 

 

 

 

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So far, I have the control surface built. There are some pics here: http://midibox.org/forums/topic/20731-waiting-for-parts/

I originally built a stereo Version 1 sid, with two SID modules and two cores. It only had an LCD and 4 buttons. Now I am upgrading to V2 with the complete control surface. 

I'm a little further on the case, but don't have pics yet. I have about half the bottom board soldered, but I am waiting on parts. I have 2 6581's and just got 2 swinSID Nano's. I haven't hooked them up yet. I thought I had an 8550 somewhere, but can't find it.

You don't need encoders with push buttons. I know there is a mod for the MBSeq where when you push the endocer, it speeds up how fast the values change, but it is not required. My encoders do not have buttons.

I have a PicKit2, so I could program your PICs for you, but you would have to mail them to the US :(

Good luck!

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Haha had to laugh with your 8580, because the exact same thing i had in my case, gladly I found it in another old C64 after while, but I also thought id lost it :)

 

I think i am going to buy a pickit or some china ripoff and then flash it myself, seems faster and cheaper overall :)

 

btw did you see, synthtopia.com there is a little article about the midibox sid.

 

So my base PCB is almost finished, from a solderstandpoint, right now I only got a pre flashed PIC, old one from smash tv back in the days but its the flahs intensive one P18F462 or something like that, it aint got no CAN on it, but maybe I hope I still can test the first 2 SIDs in my setup with it.

 

I did sample the other PICs from microchip, but it might take some weeks before they arive.

 

 

Last question for now, as I come to the ultimate seciton of my base PCB, thepower supplies.

 

In my option B I have to solder 3 LDOs, the 7809 twice and one 12V device.

 

Why are there 2x +9V LDOs in it, I couldnt find out:

V2 is +9V and it will supply all the SIDs, but what is V1 for?

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Have you gone through this thread: http://midibox.org/forums/topic/20376-one-mb-6582-one-power-supply-a-tutorial/ ?

I think I am going to go that route. I like using the old C64 brick, but who knows how long it will last.

 I got a bunch of parts yesterday, and have everything done on my base board except the power section and the current limiting resistors for the LEDs.

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Quick update on my behalf.

I dont know where i got the rotary encoders from, but it seems i can detent them by opening, so i will do so for 14 parts besides the main menu encoder, I hope this i sright, and nothing else will be used as an menu encoder. btw i think i got the one from the netherland voti.nl.

 

What stops me a bit is the missing frontpanel, maybe i will lasercut it in my local fablab, but i do not know if thta can happen in the next days, so i am a bit stuck with the led matrix, i would like to solder them when i know the front panel measures.

 

Today i orderedthe Pics and some more Amegas88 for the swinSID, at first i got some Atmega88V turns out the V variant is for probably less than 32MHz, the PA is also only 20MHz but will be driven with a 32MHz clock anyway, I hope this all works out, it is not my designs, someone else did those, so I hope it will work :)

 

For now I am probably trying to lasercut the fronts tomorrow, and will get the PICs flashed, when they hopefully arrive tomorrow morning.

If that does not work out :) whihc it probably does not, recalling murphy, i got one PIC18F452, the one without CAN onboard, and will try try to work 2 SIDs from that one, just to get a proof that the whole thing works.

Really looking forward to producing the first sounds..

 

Ah and btw I did recycle the original PSU socket and power switch from the original PCB by destroying it today :)

Maybe i will try fitting in the midiBOX into the original case C64 as well, but I will decide on that later, making sound is more important right now, btw I saw your milled pictures, really looks beautiful.

cheers

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just a quick updateon behalf of the lcd connection:

 

I can only detect D7 to D4 connected on all the 4 PICS to J15, the LCD port, is that true or some defect? I guess right now maybe the LCD is working in a different mode and those connections are not needed, did not power up yet to see if it is working.

 

Just noticed and thought hm this seems strange, will maybe come back to it when it doesnt work.

On a sidenote on my original mike smashtv PCBs those pins were all correctly connected according to the uCapps website documents.

 

we will see how it works out. btw all the PICs did arrive , but i do not know if i can flahs them otday i think rather not, so i will test the thing with my old PIC and only 2 SIDs

 

 

PS: Edit#1

Just saw in the wilba design files, somehow it loads very unstable on my PC, ist a huge pdf or my pdf reader is broken,

the baord file, and there it can be seen where those ocnnections go, so no probrlem after all everythign is fine

Edited by mex
UPDATE

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Just beeing able to flashing my pics..

 

i dont know exactl yif it worked, but the pickit kit says so, i cannot verify this, but anyway i gotta trust something.

 

Now i did want to update the mios on the pics in my PCB setup, but sadly the MIOS is not recognizing my midi PICs yes.

Does someone know what the hell J11_CORE is for? Is it just a bridge from MIDI(UART) TX to RX? I had that jumper set all the time, to it was kind of a short, i hope i cannot damage the output pins with that.

 

I can test a feedback loop just liek stated in the troubleshooting, but my PIC MIOS is never recognized yet.

Just spent 2 hours of my night to get it working, also tried my older PIC18F4620 setup, doesnt seem to recognize it neither, but i know that that one worked like 4 years ago :)

 

THen something odd happend, i was pulling and stuffing the J11_CORE in and out while querying to see if i can can loops, and indeed it happend, and surprise in the beginngin one time he also stated MIOS recognized, but of course i cannot work with that, as it vanished when i pulled the J22 again or stuffed it back in.

 

So the journy goes on.

BTW brilliant written troubelshoot guide, really something to read acutually helpfull and sensible stuff, great work.

 

Right now i am suspicious of my noname midi interface, i got that from amazon a while ago for 7€ or so, but it did work for the last 'PIC and MIOS so im am not that sure, well maybe it works with notes but not with sysex, do not know that yet, i cannot recall if i bought a mios PIC back in the time or just a preburned one, but i think  i got it from the german site so probably only bootloader installed, which means mios upload did work once before, well maybe it is dependent on my win10 now, who knows..

 

Second thing, as i am not yet that familiar with PICs and i got myself of course the cheap diamex substitue instead of the pickit flasher, I am a bit suspicious about it. I am using the official microchip software for the pickit2 kit, and it states that my code is on the device, but i cannot see that , cannot verify it,the button simply says its not possible, i guess somehow the pic is not readable, at least that would make a bit of sense.

So if the upload of the bootloader did not work, then of coursethe MIOS wouldnt work.

 

Which leads me to something new..

Is the pic supposed to be MIOSable if only the bootloader is flahsed the first time?? I would assume maybe not, hmmmmmm.

 

anyway it is kind of late, i am passed my sleeping window for 2 hours, so will inform you as soona s i squeeze the first bit of sound out of it.

 

cheers

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