Mounting my first core module.

[dcreatorx]

Hi to everybody. I am finally mounting my first core module and i have 1 question. The core modules they sent to me, are different to the ones explained at ucapps.de, they have been actualized. SDo i just received this material from www.avishowtech.com :

MBHP CORE_R3 Orderlist (last update: 10-2005)

+-------+---------------------------------------+-------+--------------------+

| Loc.  | Description                          | Qty  | Mouser Part #      |

+-------+---------------------------------------+-------+--------------------+

| IC3  | Voltage Regulator 7805                |    1 | 512-LM7805CT      |

| IC1  | IC-Socket for PIC                    |    1 | 571-3902625        |

| IC2  | Optocoupler 6N138                    |    1 | 782-6N138          |

| IC2  | IC-Socket for 6N138                  |    1 | 571-3902612        |

| Q1    | Transistor BC337                      |    1 | 625-BC337-16      |

|R3,9-10| Resistor 10 kOhm                      |    3 | 291-10K            |

| R5    | Resistor 5.6 kOhm                    |    1 | 291-5.6K          |

| R6    | Resistor 1.2 kOhm                    |    1 | 291-1.2K          |

| R2,4  | Resistor 1 kOhm                      |    2 | 291-1K            |

|R7,8,11| Resistor 220 Ohm                      |    3 | 291-220            |

| R1    | Resistor 100 Ohm                      |    1 | 291-100            |

| C3    | Ceramic Cap 100nF=.1uF "104"          |    1 | 80-C412C104K5R    |

| C6    | Ceramic Cap 330nF=.33uF (2.54LS) "334"|    1 | 80-C320C334M5U    |

| C1,2  | Ceramic Cap 33pF (2.54LS) "330"      |    2 | 140-50N2-330J      |

| C4    | Electrolytic Cap 10uF (5DIA-2LS)      |    1 | 140-HTRL25V10      |

| C5    | Electrolytic Cap 2200uF (13DIA-5LS)  |    1 | 140-HTRL16V2200    |

| D1    | Diode 1N4148                          |    1 | 78-1N4148          |

| BR1  | Bridge Rectifier                      |    1 | 625-W08G          |

| VR1,2 | TrimPot 10 k                          |    2 | 531-PTC10H-10K    |

| Jxx  | 1-row SIL Headers (49 pins)          |    2 | 517-6111TG        |

| Jxx  | 2-row SIL Headers (24 pins)          |    1 | 517-6221TG        |

| X1    | 10mhz 49S Crystal                    |    1 | 73-XT49S1000-20    |

+-------+---------------------------------------+-------+--------------------+

But i don't know why i have an orange uselesss ceramic cap (334) that is going at no place. May-be it's an additional by-pass cap needed to help improve the power integrity? If so, why just one is included ? Maybe i don't need two because when the board was updated the way the by.pass caps are going had changed ?  Thank you for your help.

Other question . . .  should i use isolated cable in every jumper/bridge ? Or i can do it just with resistor legs ? Thanks for your help.

[kokoon]

bridges: if you're bridging on the copper side (conductive) you need isolated wire. in your case you're probably bridging on the other side so you can use the cut-off legs.

i don't know about the bypass cap - it shou work without them too but it's apparently best to put them as close to the IC as possible. but let someone else answer that one :) midibox is my first ever electronic project so i'm a total n00b.

[smashtv]

Hi to everybody. I am finally mounting my first core module and i have 1 question. The core modules they sent to me, are different to the ones explained at ucapps.de, they have been actualized.

Specific info on the differences is herein my info section: http://www.avishowtech.com/mbhp/info.html

But i don't know why i have an orange uselesss ceramic cap (334) that is going at no place. May-be it's an additional by-pass cap needed to help improve the power integrity? If so, why just one is included ? Maybe i don't need two because when the board was updated the way the by.pass caps are going had changed ?  Thank you for your help.

This is probably an accidental spare (unfortunately it happens, my method of packing 100 kits at a time helps me make sure all the parts are there, but does not show me when I put in extras)

So please take a look at my info pages, and if your capacitors are all where they should be then the .33uF (334) is a spare.

This also happened with another of the kits from that batch.  I'll pull the sample from that lot and count the caps, but if one has extras, i'm sure they all do....

Sorry for the confusion!

Best

Smash

[dcreatorx]

Ahh ok, so you're logged in here ! What a cool thing ! Ok, so the orange (334) it's a spare, right ? That's cool. Other question i have to ask you, if the bridges/jumpers should be soldered at the bottom side of the board, and if they be soldered with isolated cable. Maybe just the larger one should be soldered with isolated and not the others ? I have to say that your service it's fast and of a good quality, thank you.

[smashtv]

Ok, so the orange (334) it's a spare, right ? That's cool.

Yes, if you have more than one .33uF in the kit one is an extra.  Sorry for causing confusion (to everyone with the "spares") 

Other question i have to ask you, if the bridges/jumpers should be soldered at the bottom side of the board, and if they be soldered with isolated cable. Maybe just the larger one should be soldered with isolated and not the others ?

bridges: if you're bridging on the copper side (conductive) you need isolated wire.

Kokoon is 100% right on this, I usually use cut resistor legs for small ones and small gauge insulated wire for the long runs, all on the top side of the board, stuck to the board with a couple of dots of RTV silicone.....Old habits.... ;D

This takes tons of extra time though, tack soldering your long jumpers to the solder side is the most painless way.....

I have to say that your service it's fast and of a good quality, thank you.

Thank you!  :)

Best

Smash

[dcreatorx]

Ok, sorry for my n00b questions but here's one more : On the core board, the small and medium bridges are soldered on the normal side way, and the large brigde is soldered at the other side ?

I will use resistor legs for the small one, and small isolated cable for the medium and the large one.

Is that right ? Thank you for the help.  ::)

[smashtv]

Ok, sorry for my n00b questions but here's one more : On the core board, the small and medium bridges are soldered on the normal side way, and the large brigde is soldered at the other side ?

It's up to you, this is totally up to what you prefer......My habit is all jumpers on the parts side, but the boards look cleaner and it takes way less time to put the long/insulated ones on the solder side.  ;)

I will use resistor legs for the small one, and small isolated cable for the medium and the large one.

Is that right ? Thank you for the help.  ::)

You got it!

Best

Smash

[dcreatorx]

Well, my first core module is ready to be powered and tested, but . . .  how can i power it ? .... i'm an electronics n00b and i don't know such as that things. Thanks. .   ???

[ EDIT ]

Ok, now it's powered i cutted the head of a laptop power cable, and now the power is running throug the core. But . . i never used a tester before.

Could you explain me a little bit what this exactly means and how i have to use the tester to go for it ?

IC1:MCLR(1) - IC1:Vss(12) = 5V

IC1:Vdd(11) - IC1:Vss(12) = 5V

IC1:Vdd(32) - IC1:Vss(31) = 5V

IC2(8) - IC2:(5) = 5V

I know again that i am a fucking n00b, but . . . thanks. 

8)

[moebius]

Hmm..

Did your n00b test pass ok? Looks like it.  ;D (tell me if I'm wrong)

So, to the next step.

M

[kokoon]

if you're making mbsid then it would make sense to make this first.

[dcreatorx]

I think i don't know how to do that, seriously. . . what can i do man ?  I mean, i don't know how to read electrical or electronic maps. I know i can do it, but . . let's see : Is this optimized PSU already inside the commodore 64 ? Or you have to create a new one ? How can i start  ? Thanks.

[kokoon]

it's a circuit you make and then you connect the c64 psu to it.

i'm also a n00b but i didn't have much difficulties making it. reading the schemes is really easy.

-/\/\/\- is a resistor

-||- is a capacitor

-)|- is a polarized capacitor (electrolytic for instance)

the ->|- is a diode but the combination of the 4 diodes in that schematic is called a "bridge" of some sort - but you just buy what it's written there - B40C800. it has 4 pins.

you buy all the parts and then just connect them together like shown in the schematic. i used the test board (the yellow board with a ~3mm grid of holes with little copper circles around each). you can get the switch and the connector from a c64.

get all the parts and then ask here for further instructions.

[dcreatorx]

Ok, i talked to an electronics professor at my college and now i know what i have to do, but i have 1 question. In this schema, there are two things that you can't buy in a local shop.

The C64 LED and the C64 power plug. The LED it's ok, because it's plugged with a connector. But how can i get the powerplug off the main C64 board ? It's soldered and if i don't have a desolder i can't do it, right ? A desolder costs 50 € ! Thanks for answering my questions. 

[kokoon]

1. you don't really need the led

2. the power socket and the power switch: for de-soldering you'll need a normal soldering-iron (what you use for soldering) and a de-soldering pump (a few euro - probably less than 5 euro) or a de-soldering braid (a wire which attracts the solder very easily - you can buy this also - a few euro)

although when i was desoldering my plug and switch off my C64 i didn't have any of those and i managed to unsolder them just with my soldering iron. takes a bit of patience but you can do it.

[dcreatorx]

Ok, thank you for the information . .  i will try to desolder it just with the solder.

UGhhh i can't figure out how to mount the PSU . . . can somebody explain me how can i do it ? Do I need a protoboard ? . . . I don't know how to do this thing ! Thanks..  :-[

[kokoon]

i don't know what that board is called but it's that cheap yellow board with a grid of holes in it. i think people here call it "breadboard". i think the protoboard is the white one for wire-wrapping. just make sure it has copper solder points around each whole.

like this:

[dcreatorx]

Yes, ok ! I talked again to a electronics professor at the college and he explained me how can i do it. The protoboard (or breadboard) helps you testing project circuits before create them definitively on a real board. But , when it is working already, how do you create the final circuit ? Is there a board design for the PSU ? Many thanks for your efforts to teach me, kokoon !  :D

[kokoon]

you don't *have to* make a "real" (printed) circuit. it's cleaner and probably more durable but i think most people here just keep the breadboarded PSUs. i can post a photo of mine (bottom side - where all the connections are) when i get home but that won't be before tomorrow evening.

in short - note that this is my first electronic project ever - i've only made 3 of such boards and this could be all much different from how other (experienced) people do this. i figured this out myself and there could be much easier ways :)

1. first you think hard to figure which component should be placed where to make as little connections as possible. that took me the longest.

2. then you connect them together - according to the schematic - using the cut off legs of resistors and such. and where they're overlapping you use isolated wire. you can also make "jumpers" on the other side so you theoretically don't need isolated wire. but i think it's the easiest to use whatever you need.

3. you use the multimeter to check the connections - according to the schematic. i usually set it to resistance measurement and when i get non-infinite resistance (no conduction) i know that the line (connection) is working. you also double check all the resistor and capacitor values, orientation of polarised elements... everything must be checked before you plug the power cord in.

4. you plug the power cord and measure the output voltages. if all's okay then you've done it. ;)

this is my broccoli18 programmer - much less complex - but you can get the idea how the connecting is done.

bottom shot:

top shot:

another top shot:

[dcreatorx]

Ok, so i'll do it with that breadboard. I'm going to buy everything i need this evening, i will speak again lartz. Thanks so much cocoon !

[kokoon]

thats kokoon! ;)

no problem about the help though - i this place has been wonderfully helpful to me and i'm trying to continue that spirit!

[dcreatorx]

Sorry about the typing, Kokoon ! When i was about to pay at the electronics shop a problem succed with my credit card, and finally i couldn't  bought the stuff !!  >:(

But i'll do it tomorrow and show the results here then. Grrr...

[dcreatorx]

Ufffff . . ..    ???  I think i can't manage to do this without any kind of instructions . . if somebody help me doing it, i will resume all this progress and make a .html toot, and if the admins want it, i can upload it here. The problem is that i don't know where to put every component over the board ! ! The C64 Power connector have a very fat legs, so i can't plug it in to the breadboard. I am triyng to solder thinner legs to that fat legs of the connector, but, after that . . where i connect the rest ? I need to know where to plug correctly the components to create the PSU ! ! ! I know that i am very n00b but i'm trying to learn and surpass myself every day but i need some help on this... Thank  you in advance, uccaps friends.

[kokoon]

regarding the connector legs - what i did was make the breadboard holes bigger. just use a spike of some sort or a very small cross-shaped screwdriver... just widen the 6 holes.

regarding the rest of the construction... what exactly is the problem? you can see from the schematic which part is connected to which right?

i could take a photo of mine but 1) i don't have the camera with me now (only cellphone camera) and 2) i think it's a good first-step effort to make this. sort of an excercise  ;)

if you absolutely can't manage to make it then sure thing - we can help you out - but first try it yourself.

take a piece of paper (resembling your breadboard) and try drawing the components on it. if the connections (wires) cross then you'll have to use the isolated cable (you understand this right?) or a bridge on the other side (provided you have room for it - no component at that exact place). so - the fewer the crossings, the easier the work to do. ofcourse you shouldn't take this "optimization" too far - that could result in even more complicated shematic (i hope you understand what i mean) - i got 4 jumpers at the end i think. or maybe 5.

after you draw it you just place the components in their places and solder them. then you clip off their legs and solder the connections like you draw them. you can use the cut off legs. or instead of cutting the legs you can bend them to make connections and then solder them.

ask specific questions and we'll (well at least I will) answer - i know this can be a pain in the ass but once you get it going it's really nothing special.

[dcreatorx]

Ok, i finally did it ! If it works, i will post a pair of pictures here to make it easyer for electronics n00bs. But i have another question now . . . The C64 PSU it's so heavy ! ! ! It weight it's like 1'5 Kg . . .  What is the proper way to feed the MBSID ? How you did it ? Can you build your own light weight  220 to 5Cv - 9Cv transformer ? Thanks as always !

[kokoon]

why does the PSU weight bother you? the whole idea of this is that you can use the original PSU. it's a good one and it serves the MBSID perfectly. also - i don't think such a transformer can be much lighter.

so you haven't tested your circuit yet? first check it with a multimeter so you don't blow the fuse in the C64 PSU.