Fatar Studio 90 MIDIBOXed

[docbrown]

Hi guys,

First off. I have a midi keyboard controller Fatar Studio 90 (http://www.synthony.com/vintage/st90.html) which only transmit in channel 1. :( There is this split function but there is no way to controll what channel that a certian zone to transmit. >:(  I know I could just buy a nice controller like CME or M-audio, but I don't like their keyboard action.

Since I've been reading this forum, I figured, maybe I can just replace the internal logic of the Studio 90 completely with MIDIBOX modules.

Basically, I need it to be able to transmit on multiple zone and assign the channels accordingly. Also able to keep the sustain pedal functionality if possible.

Is it do-able? I figured if you can midified some old synth, why not a keyboard controller with limited function to a nicer and geekier controller ;D. I even thought of adding the MBSEQv2 inside this controller.. 8)

please advice..

docbrown..

[stryd_one]

F*ckin rookies. That's not vintage! "Oh...it's weighted, nobody plays those anymore, they're no good for drums" argh! I love that board. I've got a fully weighted yamaha KX-76 at home, probably a little more like vintage than yours ;)

You could buy a new weighted keyboard, but be prepared to spend upwards of a grand to get one.

You could almost certainly hook it up to a midibox, but of course it depends on how the keys are attached (speaking electronically, not mechanically). A MIOS core could give you as many split zones as you want, or you could have them act like different keyboards by using pedals to switch to virtual boards, you name it.... You could have like 127 zones spread over 127 virtual keyboards, in theory ;)

Can you get your hands on a service manual for the board? Right now, yuo need to find out how the keys are connected/scanned,switched etc etc.

[docbrown]

F*ckin rookies. That's not vintage! "Oh...it's weighted, nobody plays those anymore, they're no good for drums" argh! I love that board. I've got a fully weighted yamaha KX-76 at home, probably a little more like vintage than yours ;)

:P  :P  :P

Yup, I know I love the action of this thing too.. ;D Its kind'a vintage :D  :D

You could buy a new weighted keyboard, but be prepared to spend upwards of a grand to get one.

Sorry, short of ca$h.

Can you get your hands on a service manual for the board? Right now, yuo need to find out how the keys are connected/scanned,switched etc etc.

One thing that I noticed is its using a diode matrix switch for its keyboard.. The rest I have no clue.. I'm researching the net right now for info about this controller.

The idea popped in to my head just about an hour ago.. :)

Thanks for the info Stryd_One..

[stryd_one]

One thing that I noticed is its using a diode matrix switch for its keyboard..

Excellent, that's the bit you need to know. If it's a scanning matrix you should be able to adapt QBAS's velocity sensitive keyboard scanning matrix code. He will hopefully email it to me shortly and a certain moderator will host the files for the community :)

[Sinnsyk]

Why not change the outcoming MIDI signal, instead of rebuilding the whole thing.

It should be possible to just change the channel of an incoming MIDI-signal, and send it Through. That should take less work and can't (really) go wrong..

You could build some buttons to change channel at free spaces in your case, and then you are finished...

[henrygr]

Iw onder if they 're-released' the keyboard using the same circuitry as all of the old one- ie. all functions available, just not 'made' available for marketing purposes- a common tact.

I have the oold Fatar Studio 900 which has a bit more functionality. If you wanted to send me a better description of the circuit board, or post a photo maybe, I'll compare the two and see if the above is true!

MP

[stryd_one]

Nah that'd be too smart. ;D Good point sinnsyk.

You've already got a perfectly good signal, it's just only on one channel. WAYYY easier to mangle serial bytes than PCB's. and that 'board has ooodles of space for an LCD, and most probably for the core module internally, so you could run wire from the fatar PCB, to the core module, and to the existing midi plugs.

Hey I have to highly recommend a PLED display like Wilba's for your board. The first thing I said when I saw it was "Imagine that mounted flush on a black box, it'd look so damn nice, like the lettering was just shining right out of the metal". Well actually that was the second thing I said, right after I stopped swearing at how nice it was ;)

It just occurred to me, I could do the same thing with my KX-76 It has the bomb action, but the interface is so crap, it's all programmed in hex using two 7-LED digit displays :-\ Plenty of space internally too.

The MIDI Router would be a good way to do this. One MIDI In, a few Outs, and maybe some modifications to the code for custom features...

[henrygr]

Would love to replace the board in mine. Anyone aware of a succussful upgrade to an Mbox project?

Not necessarily the Fatar, but any keyboard would be a start..

[docbrown]

Why not change the outcoming MIDI signal, instead of rebuilding the whole thing.

It should be possible to just change the channel of an incoming MIDI-signal, and send it Through. That should take less work and can't (really) go wrong..

I think this does not address the multi splits zones.

[docbrown]

If you wanted to send me a better description of the circuit board, or post a photo maybe, I'll compare the two and see if the above is true!

MP

Ok, I will have time this weekend to take it a part again and take some pictures..

[docbrown]

Hey I have to highly recommend a PLED display like Wilba's for your board.

Yes that will be schweet on this thing.. 8)

It just occurred to me, I could do the same thing with my KX-76 It has the bomb action, but the interface is so crap, it's all programmed in hex using two 7-LED digit displays  :-\ Plenty of space internally too.

This is exactly popped in my head last night.. See what I mean... :)

The MIDI Router would be a good way to do this. One MIDI In, a few Outs, and maybe some modifications to the code for custom features...

Good info.. This is what I'm looking for..

thanks.. docbrown..

[DrBunsen]

I think this does not address the multi splits zones.

Sure it could.  Just need to add some code (lookup table?) that changes the MIDI channel of a note based on which note it is, and a menu function for assigning the splits.

[stryd_one]

That's right... Think about it...what's the difference between 127 DIN's and 127 MIDI Notes?....

[stryd_one]

I can write up some code to do keysplits that will paste right into the router if anyone is interested?

I was thinking of a kind of keymapping thing, Set out a range of keys with a min and max, and give them a channel shift and a key shift and a port shift... That way you could have a bunch of splits, overlapping if you want, and forward them to any of the outputs, with the channels and or keys shifted up or down.

What do you think?

[docbrown]

That's right... Think about it...what's the difference between 127 DIN's and 127 MIDI Notes?....

Oh, I see. Sorry guys, I'm just ignorant about MIDI and the MOIS capability..

[docbrown]

I can write up some code to do keysplits that will paste right into the router if anyone is interested?

I was thinking of a kind of keymapping thing, Set out a range of keys with a min and max, and give them a channel shift and a key shift and a port shift... That way you could have a bunch of splits, overlapping if you want, and forward them to any of the outputs, with the channels and or keys shifted up or down.

What do you think?

;D ;D ;D ;D Yes!!!! pretty please with cherries on top!! ;D ;D ;D ;D

EDIT: Question: So, is this just going to be the MIDI router with key splits/mapping? And maybe a DIN for control switches and encoders?

[Sinnsyk]

As long as you don't use more then 8 DIN's, you could connect them to the core, I thought. So, no need for a DINX module.

[stryd_one]

Don't worry mate :)

The code is pretty simple, it's basically "if the note number is < the split, then the channel = X; if the note number is > the split, then channel = Y"

I hope this gives some concept of how the splits can be done. The router design is really excellent, and makes it just that easy to manipulate the data which is sent :)

[docbrown]

As long as you don't use more then 8 DIN's, you could connect them to the core, I thought. So, no need for a DINX module.

Sorry for a dumb question. if "DIN" stands for Digital INput, what does DINX stands for? Please inform my clueless mind...  :-[

[tos]

DIN x 4

Or DIN times four.

[docbrown]

DIN x 4

Or DIN times four.

thanks..

[docbrown]

Don't worry mate :)

Since I am code challenged, I still need to learn ASM & C coding. I just have a some scripting experience with servers and stuff. So thanks in advance..

[stryd_one]

No sweat, I'll write up a keysplit (actually a set of remapped keyranges) this weekend. Probably tonight in a fit of insomnia, as per usual for me on friday night ;)

How many keyranges do you want (keeping in mind that they can be overlapping or nested within one another)?

[docbrown]

No sweat, I'll write up a keysplit (actually a set of remapped keyranges) this weekend. Probably tonight in a fit of insomnia, as per usual for me on friday night ;)

Well, who needs sleep really... ;D Actually, I should be hitting the sack myself coz its 11:20pm thursday here in California and I have to get up by 5:00am..

How many keyranges do you want (keeping in mind that they can be overlapping or nested within one another)?

Good question? My best guess for now will be 3. Drums, Bass, & leads.. Overlapping not sure yet..

[henrygr]

FYO

Went to www.fatar.com Pretty cool. They now sell keyboards only (did anyone else know that?). I e-mailed them on the chances of getting the matrix layout for their keyboards, but I would say the chances of getting a reply would only be two- none and f-all.

However, I wonder what their minimum order for keyboards would be. It would certainly cut costs for midi boxers to be able to buy the ebony and ivory only and build around it based on their needs.

Any thoughts?

Perhaps I'll contact them again in the hope of finding such info. Imagaine- an 88 key weighted mechanism for  little or nothing....drool!