Great sequencer! Can I suggest a few things?

[Futureman]

Excuse my ignorance, but I've got a few small ideas for the next revision etc...

- Could there be a new mode (in track event page) with one of the layers be a probabilty percentage of the event happening?

ie, Note + Length + Probability?

I was sequencing my Prophet5 with the Seq3 and some events were so short, that the P5 did not always play them, which was pretty cool.. And I thought that others might dig such a feature. This would be very cool for drums, with some hits sometimes happening..

- I've noticed, that while the sequencer is running, and chain is enabled, the seq3 often looses it's relative position.. enabling "Sync to measure" does not fix this.

The only fix seems to be stopping & Starting the sequencer again.

- Could the Sync to measure also apply to a 32 step length, if the measure is 32 steps long? Currently, it syncs to a 16 step measure, regardless of how long that pattern is.

Once again, what a great sequencer.. I'd love to be able to code this myself, but it's way beyond my abilities.

Much regards

Mike

[TK.]

Hi Mike,

Note + Length + Probability?

no problem, I will add this.

Any other suggestions for new event modes?

- I've noticed, that while the sequencer is running, and chain is enabled, the seq3 often looses it's relative position.. enabling "Sync to measure" does not fix this.

The only fix seems to be stopping & Starting the sequencer again.

Are you using any "progression parameter"? Chaining doesn't work properly together with these functions.

- Could the Sync to measure also apply to a 32 step length, if the measure is 32 steps long? Currently, it syncs to a 16 step measure, regardless of how long that pattern is.

Yes, I think I should add the possibility to sync to any measure between 1..128 steps - it would also solve other issues (e.g. synchronized pattern change after 4 bars)

This will be a global parameter for all tracks.

Best Regards, Thorsten.

[Futureman]

Super!

Thanks for taking my ideas onboard!

I've also noticed a small thing in the real time record..

I'm not sure if it's my playing, but it feels like it is often recording into the step before I press the note. not E.S.P ... lol.

It seems like I have to make my playing style rather lazy in order to record the riff I want, if that makes sense?

Is it possible to add some sort of 'playing error' or quantisation magnetism etc.. This value could be between 0% (off) and 49% (probably way to 'eager'), I'd be guessing a max value of 25% would be more than enough.

This value could be global, in the 'record' page, and be specified in 96th's if that was easier to implement.

Eg, If I play a note right at the end of step 1 (say 80% through step 1) , can it record that event in step 2?

Once again, Great work! This sequencer is truly inspirational!

Regards

Mike

[stryd_one]

Good stuff here thanks guys!

About the recording thing.... Maybe it would help if there was a small delay of incoming data before it is recorded, which would cause notes played just a fraction too early, to fall in the correct step?

[mattias]

Hi Mike,

no problem, I will add this.

Any other suggestions for new event modes?

Are you using any "progression parameter"? Chaining doesn't work properly together with these functions.

Yes, I think I should add the possibility to sync to any measure between 1..128 steps - it would also solve other issues (e.g. synchronized pattern change after 4 bars)

This will be a global parameter for all tracks.

Best Regards, Thorsten.

How about a drummode event 3 individual gates (notes) per layer!! I know this can be done but it is not straigtforward...

And mybe a simple chord event mode wher you trigger chords insted of notes...

Maybe a LFO event mode where you can trigger an LFO restart, sending CC, and LFO speed back to the LFO!!

Just some ideaes!!

[Futureman]

Good stuff here thanks guys!

About the recording thing.... Maybe it would help if there was a small delay of incoming data before it is recorded, which would cause notes played just a fraction too early, to fall in the correct step?

Yea! Thats an great solution, assuming it can be implemented easily?

That way, naturally late keyboard players would have a delay of 0 (assuming we are talking about 96th's) and naturally early players might set it to say 10 96th's.

Regards

Mike

[Futureman]

Good stuff here thanks guys!

About the recording thing.... Maybe it would help if there was a small delay of incoming data before it is recorded, which would cause notes played just a fraction too early, to fall in the correct step?

On a side note, (this might seem obvious) but you would want the sequencer to echo out the note in real time (no delay) , but the note sent to the recorder would be delayed.

Regards

Mike

[TK.]

Yes, I know about the imperfections in live record mode - I also would like to have it more intuitive

Is it possible to add some sort of 'playing error' or quantisation magnetism etc.. This value could be between 0% (off) and 49% (probably way to 'eager'), I'd be guessing a max value of 25% would be more than enough.

This value could be global, in the 'record' page, and be specified in 96th's if that was easier to implement.

About the recording thing.... Maybe it would help if there was a small delay of incoming data before it is recorded, which would cause notes played just a fraction too early, to fall in the correct step?

I'm thinking about a possible solution since months, but haven't found a good - feasible and completely working - one.

I would prefer an absolute delay which works independent from the BPM - but there are no free HW resources (especially because Timer0 will be used for the Tap Tempo function in future)

A delay depending on the microticks (96th's) would lead to a different feeling on slower BPM rates. I tried this some time ago, but it was more confusing than today - and the code looked really uggly and error prone. E.g. I wasn't able to properly record on chained tracks anymore! :(

How about a drummode event 3 individual gates (notes) per layer!! I know this can be done but it is not straigtforward...

See my long explanation in the 808 forum:

http://www.eight-oh-eight.org/phpbb2/viewtopic.php?t=169

Summary: there is an alternative firmware available which works perfectly for drum patterns. :)

And mybe a simple chord event mode wher you trigger chords insted of notes...

There are already two different chord modes, what is missing exactly?

Maybe a LFO event mode where you can trigger an LFO restart, sending CC, and LFO speed back to the LFO!!

not sure if I will ever implement this... too many requests, not enough sparetime. However, some more ideas regarding CC automation can be found via search function

Best Regards, Thorsten.

[Futureman]

I'm thinking about a possible solution since months, but haven't found a good - feasible and completely working - one.

I would prefer an absolute delay which works independent from the BPM - but there are no free HW resources (especially because Timer0 will be used for the Tap Tempo function in future)

A delay depending on the microticks (96th's) would lead to a different feeling on slower BPM rates. I tried this some time ago, but it was more confusing than today - and the code looked really uggly and error prone. E.g. I wasn't able to properly record on chained tracks anymore! :(

Thats interesting, I would have thought that a delay that is proportional to the tempo would have been more intuitive.. Would a fixed delay also be out of 'whack' at higher tempo's?

I don't know about you, but 'Tap Tempo' is pretty low on my wish list.. Probably because my SEQ3 is slaved to Protools. But I can see that there would be many others who would deem it essential.

Anyway, it's good to know that someones working on a possible solution..

To be honest, I use the real time record more than anything on this sequencer, And would love to see polyphonic recording implemented (I know that is a BIG ask).

I was thinking, that instead of using different layers etc, Polyphonic recording could apply to a group of 4 tracks simultaniously. The lowest note being on track 1, the second on 2, 3rd on 3 etc.

With 16 tracks running, I honestly see no real need to make polyphonic recording on 1 track (using chord mode etc).

Anyway, thats my BIG BIG wish for the day... and I know it's a tall order.

Thanks again for your feedback to my feedback.

I've got 3 friends who are itching to make a SEQ3 after seeing 1/10th of what it can do!

Regards

Mike

[stryd_one]

On a side note, (this might seem obvious) but you would want the sequencer to echo out the note in real time (no delay) , but the note sent to the recorder would be delayed.

That's why I said "before being recorded"...but this requires a secondary note buffer, and TK has pointed out that there is insufficient resources :(

Tap tempo is fun but really is a gimmick. It can be easily replaced by changing BPM with an encoder, and experienced players can guess a BPM with better accuracy by ear anyway.... so I'd definitely say that more reliable recording would be a higher priority.

[bosone]

i support the ideas expressed here!  ;D

i, too, have found problems while trying to live record a sequence... i solved by chaining Sonar (cubase/logic....) out to sequencer input look here: http://www.midibox.org/forum/index.php/topic,11453.0.html

i have other ideas too....

1) new chain mode for tracks 1,2,3,4

now you can chain:

1->2

1->2->3->4

what about:

1->2->1->3

and

1->2->1->4

or even

1->2->1->3->1->2->1->4

you would be able to program repetitions with fill variations!

2)

I have found the track direction options  very fun to play with.

the "problem" is that they tend to "go out" and to create some madness when you repeatedly change the direction... i cannot explain very well.. but it's quite obvious that, if you tweak with pendulum, expeimental progression, reverse, etc... you will for sure switch the accents on the beat. this could be annoying and not very "musical".

what about inserting a button, in the same menu, to make the track "restart" from step 1 - or n - (in sync with the tempo, obvioulsy!), in order to "recover" a right step? i don't know if this make sense, it can be experimented... ot maybe to constantly retrigger the progression to step 1 (or n) after 16, 32 or 64 steps, in order to always have some "regular" beat progression that fit a 4/4 tempo...

[stryd_one]

Both those ideas are in my seq ;) In the first one you can control the current step of a track with another track, and in the second you hold a button down and hit the step to jump to that step. It doesn't reset the clocks though, that way it stays in sync; so you have to hit it before the step actually plays. I wonder if the MBSeq could do it? the first one might already be possible with the loopback ports, the second one I'm not sure...

[TK.]

With 16 tracks running, I honestly see no real need to make polyphonic recording on 1 track (using chord mode etc).

Polyphonic recording on a single track would be easier to realize than multi-track recording; I planned to go this way

what about:

1->2->1->3

and

1->2->1->4

or even

1->2->1->3->1->2->1->4

Unfortunately doesn't comply with the handshaking concept I used for chain mode (see also comments about handshaking in seq_core.inc), I would have to think about a new solution, and overwork it completely. Would this really be worth the effort?

the "problem" is that they tend to "go out" and to create some madness when you repeatedly change the direction... i cannot explain very well.. but it's quite obvious that, if you tweak with pendulum, expeimental progression, reverse, etc... you will for sure switch the accents on the beat. this could be annoying and not very "musical".

I know what you mean - In such situations, I activate the "sync to measure" function in the clock divider page, until the track rolls over. Thereafter I deactivate this function again. I could also provide an additional "push-button solution", but how should it be called so that nobody overlooks this feature?

I mean: you already overlooked the possibilities of "sync-to-measure", no? ;)

Both those ideas are in my seq  In the first one you can control the current step of a track with another track, and in the second you hold a button down and hit the step to jump to that step. It doesn't reset the clocks though, that way it stays in sync; so you have to hit it before the step actually plays. I wonder if the MBSeq could do it? the first one might already be possible with the loopback ports, the second one I'm not sure...

Second one: "manual trigger" page

Btw.: you know, that my ToDo list works like a FILO? ;)

[tt]                       

                +---------+---------+---------+---------+---------+---------+........

New User ----> | Request | Request | Request | Request | Request | Request | Requ...

request        +---------+---------+---------+---------+---------+---------+........

                <-------------- will be implemented --------------> <--------- --> somewhere burried in the forum

[/tt]

Best Regards, Thorsten.

[stryd_one]

Would this really be worth the effort?

Well I guess that depends - is the MBSeq intended to be used primarily as a performance sequencer or a studio sequencer?

The v1 was always quite studio-based but there are some performance-related things in v2, so it's hard to tell what direction to take... But I'd say that the MBSeq is still most useful in a studio environment, in which case this is not the kind of thing that it's meant to do...

Edit: Still laughing at your FILO buffer ;D

[Futureman]

... But I'd say that the MBSeq is still most useful in a studio environment, in which case this is not the kind of thing that it's meant to do...

I'm guessing this is another topic.. But I use it in the studio alone, or when we jam, and I've got a gig in a couple of weeks, And I'll be using it then..

I don't think it needs to be loaded with everything & the kitchen sink, It's pretty much the best hardware phrase sequencer out there AMEN.. I think if recording goes polyphonic & realtime record is a little more easier to deal with, It will be perfect..

I've got a heap of classy hardware.. And this thing knocks the socks off me..

- It's shuffle is stunning.. sleazy if you want, bordering on triplets if you need, all without sounding awkward.

- The arpeggio is damn cool, and inspiring.

- The direction modes, while at first seemed a bit gimmicky for me, sure are a source of inspiration if you get stuck (in conjuntion with sync to measure)

- The force to scale is pretty special too.. especially if you wanna turn out a riff in D minor.. the saddest of all keys.

- It's been made by me  (I didn't design it tho ;[ )

- The fact pretty much everything can be done stopping helps!

- The way note lengths are implemented rocks.. 

I'm interested in how others use it?

Regards

Mike

[TK.]

Thank you, the list of your favourite features is a really useful input for me! :)

Best Regards, Thorsten.

[bosone]

Unfortunately doesn't comply with the handshaking concept I used for chain mode (see also comments about handshaking in seq_core.inc), I would have to think about a new solution, and overwork it completely. Would this really be worth the effort?

the effort is yours, then YOU should decide! :)

actually, what styrd one says has sense (as usual...) if the use is in live, then the feature would be a must. in studio maybe is not so fundamental!

I know what you mean - In such situations, I activate the "sync to measure" function in the clock divider page, until the track rolls over. Thereafter I deactivate this function again. I could also provide an additional "push-button solution", but how should it be called so that nobody overlooks this feature?

I mean: you already overlooked the possibilities of "sync-to-measure", no? ;)

i will try your suggestion. honestly, i don't know how it should works!!  :P

but what about a "restart button" to restart the track from step 1 at the press of this button? this would be useful also, maybe, for making live "breakz" (or whatever they are called!):

example: you have a vocal singed sample saying: "midibox sequencer is the best" triggered by C3 at the first step of a track and with the duration of 4 bars. the sample is tempo synced to the song.

you press this button repeatedly ad get the "disco-like-effect":

mi-mi-mi-mi-mi-mi-mi-mi-midibox sequencer is the best"

;D

[TK.]

but what about a "restart button" to restart the track from step 1 at the press of this button? this would be useful also, maybe, for making live "breakz" (or whatever they are called!):

example: you have a vocal singed sample saying: "midibox sequencer is the best" triggered by C3 at the first step of a track and with the duration of 4 bars. the sample is tempo synced to the song.

you press this button repeatedly ad get the "disco-like-effect":

mi-mi-mi-mi-mi-mi-mi-mi-midibox sequencer is the best"

;D

You can do this in the manual trigger page with all selected tracks - you can re-start from any step you want

Alternatively, go into the loop page and change the loop end pointer to 1 - change back to the original value (e.g. 16) after you heart enough MiMiMiMis - this will result into a similar effect

Best Regards, Thorsten.

[dj3nk]

Does the seq already has a swing feature ? I wasnt able to found something in the documentation.  You'd just need to set a certain delay (swing percenture) for every 2nd and 4th step. I havent found a way in my software sequencer to set certain tracks to a certain swing. Used on drums (or basslines) they'll get a really more "human played" feeling

Possible ? Useful for others ?

greetz

PS: yes i am still alive ;P

[Futureman]

Yea, it already has about 6 different types of Swings, all with 16 different intensity values.

The swing is on the money as far as I'm concerned (And I own a Linndrum)

Cheers

Mike

[dj3nk]

cool thx

[ris8_allo_zen0]

About "new" chaining modes (which I'd love as a feature in my SEQ): I thought about a possible solution which can lead to many other effects: a new event mode whose events are step numbers (S1..S32), and at least one constant is a track number or a group number: when a non-empty event of this track is triggered, the track or the entire group jumps immediately to that step, the same way as using the "Manual step trigger" function. This function becomes useful only when its clock is a fraction of the target track/group. (otherwise it can be used to make custom progression models)

So, a chain like 1->2->1->3 (each 8 steps long) could be made this way: set track 1 to "step index", set its clock to 2 and length to 4, then program the events like S1 S9 S1 S17 (or S1 --- S1 S17, since an empty event will just let the things going).

For 1->2->1->3->1->2->1->4: S1 --- S1 S9 S1 --- S1 S17.

With other sequences and clock/length ratios (even uncorrelated ones), possibilities get endless...

Too nerdy?  ::)

[TK.]

Would it be sufficient to provide CCs which allow to set the step of a single track, of a group or of all groups? In loopback mode you could achieve the desribed effects, but in difference to your idea, you could also control the steps from an external controller (or sequencer) this way

Best Regards, Thorsten.

P.S.:

[tt]                       

                +---------+---------+---------+---------+---------+---------+........

New User ----> | Request | Request | Request | Request | Request | Request | Requ...

request        +---------+---------+---------+---------+---------+---------+........

                <-------------- will be implemented --------------> <--------- --> somewhere burried in the forum

[/tt]

[stryd_one]

Too nerdy?  ::)

Hope not, that's another one of my seq's features ;)

[ris8_allo_zen0]

Would it be sufficient to provide CCs which allow to set the step of a single track, of a group or of all groups? In loopback mode you could achieve the desribed effects, but in difference to your idea, you could also control the steps from an external controller (or sequencer) this way

That would be perfect for me!

[tt]                       

                +---------+---------+---------+---------+---------+---------+........

New User ----> | Request | Request | Request | Request | Request | Request | Requ...

request        +---------+---------+---------+---------+---------+---------+........

                <-------------- will be implemented --------------> <--------- --> somewhere burried in the forum

[/tt]

OMG  :o Please don't let me know what request I unintentionially thrown into the deep...