Sign in to follow this  
Followers 0
Lorenzo_m

start building a MIDIbox SID

13 posts in this topic

Hello,

I would like to start building a MIDIbox SID V2.

I read "Walkthrough" from the uCApps site, but I dont understand what are

the kits I have to buy for built a minimal MIDIbox SID solution (sorry my  English

is not so good)

I prefer to buy a kit because in my town I probably have some problems to

find components... so I prefer to buy every semi's, connectors, pots...

I own two C-64 (a old version and one more modern...) I don't understand

if I need 2 SID for stereo sounds!?

Thanks

Probably my question is very common, so can you link me similar threads??

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Hello,

I would like to start building a MIDIbox SID V2.

I read "Walkthrough" from the uCApps site, but I dont understand what are

the kits I have to buy for built a minimal MIDIbox SID solution (sorry my  English

is not so good)

I prefer to buy a kit because in my town I probably have some problems to

find components... so I prefer to buy every semi's, connectors, pots...

I own two C-64 (a old version and one more modern...) I don't understand

if I need 2 SID for stereo sounds!?

Thanks

Probably my question is very common, so can you link me similar threads??

Yes, you need two Sids for stereo, but if you've got one brown C64 and one grey 'breadbox' C64, you've got two different versions of the Sid chip, a 6581 and an 8580. Whichever you choose to go with, they will need to match.

the minimal requirements are listed about 3/4 of the way down the page here:

http://www.ucapps.de/midibox_sid_manual_hw.html

for stereo you'd need two sid kits, a core, and a din module from Smash's shop. An LCD would be a good idea as well.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

two different versions of the Sid chip, a 6581 and an 8580. Whichever you choose to go with, they will need to match.

What do you mean?

Match the SID chip is something I can make at home by myself? ;D

Or I need someone expert how have the right equipment?

sorry but... there are no problem if I will use two chips of the same

C-64 version or I have to match them all the same?

Then... I possibly would like to use it with an external MIDI/CV sequencer,

so I think I will need a MIDI implementation for my MIDIbox?

... and sorry ... in the minimal version I have no way to "play" filter...

so I have to think about a filter and OSC section!

I think the MIDIbox SID project is not so immediate! isn't it? ;D

I ask it because if I have to make a components order I probably have to

order everything I would need, and set my mind at rest! ;)

So I am sorry if my question would be borring but my English is not so good and

I make difficoult to read averything from ucapps site...

Thank you!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The C64's used different versions of the SID chip throughout their life cycle :

6581, 6582, 8580

The chip will have the # on it right on top so you can tell which version you have. If you're going to make a stereo SID, you need to have 2 chips of the same version. You can't mix a 6581 SID with an 8580 SID. So when you open up your old C64's, check to see if they both are of the same version.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

So when you open up your old C64's, check to see if they both are of the same version.

OK, thank you... so I have to looking for another C-64...

maybe my girl have a "brown" one in her garret ;)

I edit the previous post!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The C64's used different versions of the SID chip throughout their life cycle :

6581, 6582, 8580

The chip will have the # on it right on top so you can tell which version you have. If you're going to make a stereo SID, you need to have 2 chips of the same version. You can't mix a 6581 SID with an 8580 SID. So when you open up your old C64's, check to see if they both are of the same version.

Are you sure?

I'm pretty sure all you need to do is make sure you have to correct Voltage Regulator,

in each sid module, and you could have any 2 sid chips in a stereo setup then.

Sure the instructions received from the core are the same for all sids.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I'm pretty sure all you need to do is make sure you have to correct Voltage Regulator,

in each sid module, and you could have any 2 sid chips in a stereo setup then.

That's right, only problem is that it sounds like crap as 6581 and 8580 sound too different for stereo sounds. Actually even different 6581s sound very different (basic sound, different behaviour on filter sweeps etc), so if stereo is important I'd suggest using only 8580 or 6582.

The other question is: Do you really need stereo for a minimal setup MBSID? In my opinion, the possibility for stereo sounds is a nice addon, but to experience the raw power of Sid sound, I still prefer a single (mono) 6581 to any stereo stuff. That's because even the "newer" SID revisions don't sound predictable enough. On one hand, that's a good thing and brings life to the Sid sound, but it also leads to a blurred, less "in your face" sound if you play the same sound on two sids in stereo. Of course that's a matter of taste.

For a really minimal setup, I'd suggest to start with a single core and sid module, and a minimal control surface, i.e. a 2x20 LCD, 9 buttons and one encoder (to connect these you need one DIN module). You can always add more sids/cores, complete control surface etc later.

S

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

in addition to the issues sep mentioned, since the application needs different compile switches for 6581 and 8580/6582, and both sids are connected to a single core, mixing them on a stereo pair is not a good idea...

mixing them in an 8 sid configuration, however is very nice...

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

in addition to the issues sep mentioned, since the application needs different compile switches for 6581 and 8580/6582, and both sids are connected to a single core, mixing them on a stereo pair is not a good idea...

Since MB-SID V2, the compile switch for 6581 and 8580/6582 only changes the default filter range maximum, which is changeable with the control surface and stored in the ensemble.

Since only the Lead engine utilizes stereo, a 6581 and an 8580/6582 connected to one Core is not that unusable - Bassline, Drum and Multi engines would work OK, you would only notice it if the engine was allocating voices across both SIDs, i.e. polyphony in Multi engine or drum voices in Drum engine... and even that would make for some interesting effects, if eg. a bass drum sound was occasionally sounding different (more noisy and distorted).

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

ok, sorry, i thought the table was different. 

still, i wouldn't call it a stereo pair if it was never used for stereo...

anywayz, i'll stick to matching pairs

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Ok Thank you... so I do not realy need stereo  ;)

For a really minimal setup, I'd suggest to start with a single core and sid module, and a minimal control surface, i.e. a 2x20 LCD, 9 buttons and one encoder (to connect these you need one DIN module).

and what about MIDI, filter and OSC sections if I would like to assamble a 303 engine?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

and what about MIDI, filter and OSC sections if I would like to assamble a 303 engine?

Midi connectors are already on the core module (or are you talking about a USB Midi interface?).

From a minimal control surface you can adjust every parameter of sound including filter/osc. But you will need to go e.g. to the filter menu page, select cutoff and then adjust etc. So that's the minimal solution, but you can of course add more encoders and buttons if you want direct access to certaion parameters.

S

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Midi connectors are already on the core module (or are you talking about a USB Midi interface?).

From a minimal control surface you can adjust every parameter of sound including filter/osc. But you will need to go e.g. to the filter menu page, select cutoff and then adjust etc. So that's the minimal solution, but you can of course add more encoders and buttons if you want direct access to certaion parameters.

OK thank you very much!  :)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!


Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.


Sign In Now
Sign in to follow this  
Followers 0