Jidis
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Posts posted by Jidis
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Man, that is cool! Makes me want a SID.
I didn't know the VST spec allowed that level of return info. Could be good for lots of stuff ::)
FWIW- Steinberg have added a bunch of nifty "outboard patchbay" type stuff to use external gear as inserts, complete with latency compensation (I'm a Nuendo head). This is all in v.3 and should be Cubase as well.
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Speaking of front panels. I'm testing some crap with an 1/8th inch sheet of plate aluminum (easy to mill). I was trying to see how well the toner transfer PCB technique worked on metal. I dumped some circuit pictures on different parts of the sheet, smoothed with different grits of sandpaper and they looked great, so evidently it works.
I'm probably doing silver with black print soon, but a couple things I want to try are: Painted (baked on?) metal (maybe steel?) clear spray over the black to protect it (necessity) and also laying my sheet over a heating element, like a stovetop grill range, to heat it uniformly from beneath, while rolling the paper with something(?). Making sure to consistently heat all of the print for enough time is the only tricky part. Looks promising for flat sheet stock like pwx's panel.
-George
PS- The reason I just posted all that is cause I don't know what the heck I'm doing ??? I'm wondering if anyone else has any paint/metal/heat related pointers or suggestions or might stop me from burning my house down. (probably should be in tips and tricks or something)Â
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http://www.ucapps.de/mios/mios_din_dout_pin_numbers.txtI know, it's a very abstract describtion, but no volunteer has been found yet, who wants to write application specific docs
I'll try to hustle on my stuff I wanted to send Smash. It won't span anywhere close to the din/dout level, but could maybe suggest some newbie MB64/MIOS tips.
-George
PS- I've had to go back to that pin# listing every so often and keep forgetting where it is. It should maybe be linked from their MBHP pages or something for convenience.
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I meant D fit knobs - you can get knobs with a D fitting for D shafts.
Yeah, I've got a bunch of new D knobs here (one of the things I have considered selling off).
I think some splined shafts have a different number of teeth to othersI was afraid of that. That's what they feel like. The ones I have will actually fit, but you have to plan on not using the pots for any other knobs afterward. :'(
-George
PS- Smash - Why do the datasheet and images make those look like round shafts?
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Adam,
Great, tell me AFTER I get home ;)Â I was using the other one all night at the studio. Seriously though, thanks for this new stuff!
Yeah, I noticed that the returns printed a rectangle or something the other night. Your thoughts on it are probably better than mine. I was actually able to calculate how many spaces would push me into the next (real) LCD line the other night. Seeing a properly proportioned virtual LCD with the right number of characters in it is really enough for me.
What you proposed sounds good. If you could have it pull in the next string of characters, whenever it hits the current width setting and print them to the next line and so on, it should be fine. Arrowing around to navigate in the onscreen box shouldn't be difficult, as long as you're restrained by the current size settings, so you know what you're working with.
                 -Thanks Again
PS- All night I was having a great time tinkering with the CSMD file for my display, moving, resizing and renaming the parameter displays in different pages to see how they looked across the 2x40. This thing should make it a snap!
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I'm targeting some UAD EQ's. I'd ultimately like to get a layout right in front of me which mirrors the look of the onscreen parameters and maybe even specific pot labels. I also would like the most used Nuendo buttons for the project items in convenient places. I'm trying to keep everything as "practical" as I can. (not as into VSTi or effect mapping here)
-George
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f) more than one alien who have found a way to go without sleep. ;)
I considered that too, but we probably ought to keep quiet about it. We need them in here ;)
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yes you will be much better off finding D fit knobs
You mean round ones right? Round with set screw seems to be safe for most stuff here.
Eufex or anyone, Is there by chance more than one spec for the splined shafts in the 1/4" range? I got a great looking batch of aluminum knobs with holes like that, but they barely fit the splined pots I've tried here. I had to squish the two teeth together with pliers, which didn't feel too good.
-George
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Okay, so just get the PIC with the bootloader. It seemed like there was more you had to do to program it.
I was wondering what the chances for survival were in that as well. I've been compiling some dumb crap lately, but I swear I've messed up my PIC from sending it something a couple times via MIDIOx and got the screen with the top row of LCD blocks and no request messages. I've luckily got a programmer here, but is moostapha safe?
ÂI think i remember something about a PIC ID headder at the place I was going to order from. I can figure out the LCD type and that i'm using MIDI, but ihnfc what the Sysex Device ID is.I'm guessing it won't be a concern unless you'll have more than one MB or device that your host has to distinguish between.
And how much debugging would you actually need to do? And how much could you do with such a display? Does it give note values or will it let you know if you solder something wrong and the PIC can't find it, or what?Yes, you can see the note and parameter values along with which knobs or buttons you hit and make some of the basic settings through that, as well as get timeout error messages and stuff. I don't think it will give you hardware errors or anything yet, but knowing Thorsten anything's possible. ;D
Check the tutorial section for the MB64 and you should see some images of a bunch of the screens.
                           -Take Care
George (still learning the stuff too)
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I'd originally thought of having a resizeable text box for the LCD debug tool, but didn't think anyone would use it.
I'd imagine even more people would use it! :)
It would be even more useful after a box had been built, so you could move stuff around on the real LCD while it was in position, then after you've found something that looks cool you could figure out the offsets and spaces in the app.
Leaving it on the screen longer would probably be necessary though. Could you just call the same "print message" function repeatedly?
                                       - Thanks for considering!
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Hey again,
I'm still wondering about whether this "select parameter" system sounds OK, and I'd like to know if I'm safe to go ahead and incorporate it into my panel layout.
I want to be able to scroll around on my panel using some buttons and some lights to indicate which knob's parameters I'm seeing on the LCD (one "selected" LED per knob). My layout involves a group of horizontal channels, and I'd like a button at the front of each channel. Here's a rough idea of the necessary additions.
- Turn on the 1st knob's light at boot (just like the initial display page)
- Check for changes in the MB64_CURRENT_POT and if necessary, clear the previous LED and light the current one
now for the weird part...
- Also keep an eye out for signals from the "channel select" buttons (there may be 4-6 channels total)
- Keep a variable for which knob of the channel group is selected (init to #1) --- or use the CUR_POT variable
- If the current pot is already part of the channel who's button is hit increment the variable and move to the next knob (changing the CUR_POT and lighting the knob's LED too). If it's a different channel group, jump to that channel at knob #1, init the knob variable to 1 and change the CUR_POT.
- If the button gets hit two or three times, it will move from one knob to the next in that channel, incrementing the knob variable and changing the CUR_POT with that same previous "pot check" code. If you've hit the last pot in that row, it will move back to the first and init the variable.
If all this sounds OK, is there a necessary place or places in the MB64 files that it would need to be inserted? I'm also not real big on interrupts, but I'd like to learn. I'm guessing I'd have to use some to check for button hits.
If all goes well, I might also like a select LED for the channel itself (lights up when any of the channel's knobs are current), but it doesn't really matter.
                               -Thanks Again!
George    Â
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Not to hijack Eufex's post, but a few of the newbie "stumbling blocks" I jotted down at Smash's request involve that same area. In fact, I'm looking at some of my illegible scribble now that says "Why are the D.IN register defaults in non-numeric order?". I guess Eufex is looking at the actual pin numbering, but it took me a bit to figure out which D.IN and D.OUT numbering assignments worked and ended up at the correct lights. I think I may even remember certain configurations not working at all or working even though the assigned reg. was not available (I'm only testing with 8 buttons and 16 lights). It may also need mentioning that their 1-8 numbering assignments are two different batches of 1-8, as they are both referred to as shift registers.
A couple of the other ones involved the general purpose section:
- Why are they assuming we have 16 of each?
- What happens on GP pages if these values are zero, if they exceed the number of available registers, if the defines are simply left out of the main file, or how would
  you go about turning the function off? (for people on limited i/o circuits)
-Â Do they cooperate in "sharing" assignments with the previous button/LED assignments?
Sorry Eufex. I guess one of them is 'sort of' the same though ;)
              -George
PS- If TK's here- The first LCD default comment for 2x16 is listed as 4x20 or something in the main (the values are still 2x16)Â
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Adam,
I've been using MS4.4 for all my frequent test loads to my circuit (Thanks!) I've been editing and moving the MB64 parameter display items around on some of the display pages tonight on a 2x40 and actually found the LCD test section to be very helpful.
A couple things I was wondering- Have you considered enhancing that section any? It would be cool to have pref boxes or size handles for specifying an LCD size, rather than just the offset boxes, or maybe just options for the common sizes. That way you could easily see what a layout would look like while entering the text. A full resize for the on-screen display, with the number of characters/lines, plus the ability to size the whole box to your actual display size would be incredible. Also, a "hang time" setting or something to keep the message on the screen long enough to get a better look at it.
That thing's great for setting up a layout. Even with the on-screen LCD not matching the character width, it takes a fraction of the time to see how stuff looks with it that it does to keep tweaking all the strings and recompiling.
-Take Care              Â
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Most important: TIME! TIME! TIME!
As I started writing on my diploma the time for hobbies was absolutely away. I even stopped making music and much of my equipment got dusty
I know the feeling :(
Lately, I've had many nights where I get so wrapped up in PIC/electronics stuff that my reference monitors stay off the whole night, and I still don't feel like I'm getting anywhere.
                                     -George
PS- I'm convinced that Thorsten is either: a) more than one guy  b) an alien c) more than one alien d) one who has found a way to go without sleep or e) an alien who has found a way to go without sleep
Regardless, he's an example and an inspiration :)Â Â
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Seppoman,
Thanks for the reply and the fascinating project and pictures. I need to look more closely at the bottom of that thing now. I wouldn't think the couch spacing would be that much of a problem after the players were wrapped up in the game and the screen. What I meant, was sort of like how the old Mac OS's would allow you to arrange the monitor relationship in the control panel to match the actual physical orientation of your screens in dual display mode. Like, if your secondary monitor was a foot away from the main one, you could put a "gap" in the mouse tracking to make it look and feel the same.
I could probably learn some stuff from the mechanics of that couch. I ride a stationary bike most days and I'm also a drummer. I've broken cranks on two of the bikes over the years and just stuck them in storage and replaced them. For years I've wanted to fix one of the broken ones and replace the moving "arm" section with two or more electronic drum pads and a variable resistance or just a switch setup tied to the chopped off lower arm sections, which would generate a MIDI clock output and maybe even a metronome signal, if there was no sound module. That way, I could get back some decent rudiment and practice time while I exercised :) I'm a long ways from it in my PIC assembler knowledge though. I would probably have to set up some type of "clock divisor" or multiplier routines, so the tracking wouldn't lock me to some ridiculous tempo and I could change it for different things, but it would still feel synced to the motion of the pedals.
                            -Take Care
George Â
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Hey again!,
Could anyone here *very briefly* describe the purpose of the different LCD settings? I've been stuck mixing the past few nights, but when I left off, I had gotten so frustrated trying to get different display sizes or layouts, that I jumped it and moved to the buttons & lights, figuring I'd get back to it later.
From what I remember, the only thing I really got was the first offset parameter. I did figure out a "centered" 2x16 display on a 2x40, and also some sort of dual display with four different lines of stuff in two 2x16 combos on the 2x40, like if you flipped to the next display mode and it showed up on the right. I also got "8" different knob value parameters across the screen simultaneously, but they went from channels 1-4 and then jumped way up to 20 or 30 something.
The 2nd, 3rd, and 4th parameters were confusing. The decimal from hex equivalents didn't usually come out to any multiples of the display width, even though they were. (guessing that's not what they mean)
And before I waste too much learning time, how many of the following "desired functions" are impossible with a standard MB64 app:
- Obviously, the full width (non-centered) 2x40 mode
- The spacing of 4 (or more) named pot or button values across a 2x40 to align with the physical layout (like the LC)
- A way to flip or scroll from the display of one pot's parameter page to the next, without actually touching that particular control.
 For instance, if you wanted to check Nuendo's settings for your channel parameters or cue mix remotely, in snap mode, without
 the risk of changing them. Ideally, non-consecutive controls, like if a musician wanted to see what his levels were for the 12th-16th
 knobs, and had a button at that knob group to jump there from the first few knobs, and maybe go knob to knob with additional
 button hits. (probably asking too much)
- Thanks again, and sorry for the long post. Just trying to get in all the details. :)
                                     - George
PS- If the above is spread over more than a couple of the included MB64 project files, which ones should I focus on?  Â
 Â
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Hey Davo,
I've done the files too in a drill press, but they clogged really quick from all the friction being in one spot. Lately, I've been using really sharp pencil point tips, and every once in a while, I'll chuck them in a power drill at the studio. I wear a leather glove and "pinch" the tip sort of hard with progressively finer grits of folded up sandpaper, while the drill is spinning pretty fast. The last one ends up on that black emery cloth sandpaper, probably >400grit (nice smooth tips). I'm using the screw on tips like were mentioned a few posts up, in a Weller iron. Filing the spinning tips was sort of difficult to keep from putting too much lateral pressure against the point and bending them. The sandpaper works better, but things can get hot. (probably not the safest procedure in the world)
-George Â
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Make sure it's the solder sponge too. Regular ones supposedly can't handle the heat or corrode the tips. I've also heard that grinding the tips destroys part of their necessary coating, but I do it a lot myself in a drill, and a tech I really respect here does it too.
Moebius, thanks for the >5v tip too! I either didn't know, or had forgotten that :-\ I'm usually running a beefy supply before the regulator/rectifier stuff, but I always thought I was OK coming from a salvaged computer supply's 5v line
-George
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Just watched that .mov! That is cool. Needs to be parked in front of a big screen TV though. A long couch with proportional spacing to the two hands would be cool too, but when we all make MIDIbox couches, then I guess we can start nitpicking over such things ;)
Seppoman- If you're here, how accurate is the tracking on that thing (or was it mentioned already)?
George
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I was wondering if anyone else here had ever considered a "random bulk order" type system where individuals here would more or less "pay up front" for larger quantities of an inexpensive item which appealed to them, and pool the remainder together somewhere for the MB community to pick through at an exact percentage of their total.
For instance, a guy has two eBay auctions up now for two different black pushbutton caps. I *think* I have the switches which one goes with and I could maybe use 20. The dude's got a bag of 500 on each auction (yikes!), BUT, it's $13 with $7 shipping (4 cents each). I've gotten similar ones from Digikey for 75 cents or something. Now say, I come in here and announce that I will try to grab them and I need about 20, I go ahead and buy them, take my twenty, plus an extra 30 (more than I can eat for the next two years), put the leftover 450 (!) in an envelope and mail it to Smash for a couple bucks (not to volunteer him or anything ;)) and let others grab the rest, maybe in bags of 50 for around $2.20 (the original $20 + the $2 to get it to a central location / 500 x 50). So a bunch of people might get 20 or 30 dollars worth of caps for 2.20 (plus outbound sh.+handling), I get my 20 caps and Smash loses the drawer or shelf space that I would have lost, making his house look cluttered :-* Then if other people like them and add them to their orders, the money could be periodically PayPal'd back to the buyer or used as credit to get other "desirables" from Smash. Or, if they sit for a ridiculous amount of time, he/she could pay the couple bucks to bring them back home. Not much potential loss for a chance to retrieve some of the wasted supply values. Plus, we won't rape each other on the cost of sending this cheap plastic crap back and forth as some eBay dealers might do. The other cool thing is, in the event of auctions and such, we won't be at risk of inadvertently battling a fellow MIDIBoxer for the things we all like if the bidding plans were announced in advance, plus we may be made aware of good deals on things we will soon be shopping for. Maybe also give the other interested parties the ability to pay and reserve shares of an auction after it has closed.
I know this "quantity of 500" thing is a bit of an extreme exception, but there are always the 20's, 50's and 100's that you only want 6 of, and the bag(s) of cool looking knobs that you won, but never found the right project for.
Don't mean to single you out Smash, you just seem like you already kind of do the stuff, plus the "distributor" would deserve a handling cut, and they'd have access to all kinds of random parts which they could buy or trade for.
Just a long-ass thought :)Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â George
PS- (SmashTV) I haven't forgotten the MIOS doc request. After you told me to, I started scribbling down notes on everything I found troublesome from beyond the hardware, bootloader and OS stage. I'm still fighting with some design and software details, so I may need to work through them first, and may be seeking some answers here in order to keep going. I doubt my problems and findings would take anyone much further than where my box needs to go (LCD functions, no moving faders or rotarys), but they should easily help to build a framework for getting a couple steps past where the current tutorials end.    Â
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Man that is nice ::)
You've got good taste in buttons. Can we get a picture or details on what those square ones are with the finger detents? I've got a bag of those small four legged ones like you use and the darn things have square heads. I've got a 1/2" square Greenlee punch, but these are like 7.75mm. :(
-George
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It should run regular +5v and ground right guys?
Mine comes off a supply which is supposed to be 9vDC , but it appears to put off something in the 12-13 range (it's heavy with high amperage capacity). The regulator/filter part does a clean 5v for me (or 4.9x).
I think with no chips, your supply pins at the sockets should be reading very close to what's at the regulator output pin (5v).
                     (I'm not really an electronics wiz, but there's a bunch in here)
George
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It is kind of pricey @ $69
Don't feel bad, I've thought about getting the "Serial PIC'n" book from Square One, and for some reason, it lists for $188 on Amazon(!?). I think the actual price for it is in your $60-70 range, but there isn't one here to flip through to see if it's worth it.Â
-George
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I'm wishing lately that there was a full blown version of Serge's app, or something like it, where you could specify your exact i/o amounts of everything, see them on screen and use them via MIDI, as well as load your compiled MB apps (hey, I can dream can't I :) )Â Might even be a good thing for people who didn't plan to build a box and just wanted some remote functions via laptop or second computer.
I think I've spent almost as much time soldering and piecing together a test circuit with lights and buttons as I will on the final box. It's sad doing all that stuff and knowing you'll just have to tear it all to pieces if it works. :'(
-- Didn't mean to hijack your thread Pilo. I'm guessing you're wanting something that actually requires all the hardware, just not the PIC.
MIOS Studio Beta Release
in MIDIbox Tools & MIOS Studio
Posted
Adam,
A couple quick observations in the new build (I'm still at home).
- I can now reduce the extended width without restarting MS :)
- The height is still funky. Values beyond 2 actually reduce the height if anything and I haven't gotten a "1 liner" to display intentionally. It also does random things if I exceed the line limit via the return key, etc. (it sometimes suddenly shrinks the display to something really small or makes it really tall and narrow, pushing all the buttons off the bottom of the screen).
- It also doesn't stop your text at the last (maximum) character, and the length of the entered text sometimes goes beyond the window side or bottom and is cutoff. I've also seen the text string automatically resize the display and shrink it way back during a long backspace.
None of this is probably worth fighting with if it's difficult. For me, or most others, you can always get the correct size and layout with a few extra keystrokes (it's a simulated display anyway). If it prints to the MB properly, we're all set!
I'm dying to try that constant on/off message output tonight.
                                   - Thanks Again
PS - This (home) has been under Win2Ksp4 on an AthlonXP. Studio is another Athlon rig running XPPro and there's also 98SE I can check there.