Wilba
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Posts posted by Wilba
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Whoa that's a scary short to have... 12V going into the SID's audio output pin!!! I'm surprised your 6581 wasn't fried. Those things die just from looking at them the wrong way. :D
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I just did some tests using my own regulated 12V 500mA supply...
There are only 3 relevant measurements
A. straight out of the plug (i.e. at J1 pins)
B. voltage between GND (middle pin) and input pin of 7809
C. voltage between GND (middle pin) and output pin of 7809
For me, I get A=12.06V, B=10.6V, C=8.94V
For you, it's A=12.2V, B=10.8V, C=8.8V
It's a little low but OK.
Since you're using a regulated DC power supply which is tip positive, you can try putting the shunts in JBP to bypass the bridge rectifier (it's not needed). That will get rid of the 1.4V drop from the two diodes in the bridge rectifer, giving a little more voltage to the 7809, and you should probably see the 7809 output closer to 9V. You would need these shunts if you were using 6581 SIDs anyway, but it's completely safe to do for 6582/8580R5 use. Just check the power supply really is tip positive.
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All fixed and I didn't have to do anything? Cool! :D
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With no SIDs or LCD backlight draining the current, you really should get closer to 9V.
It could be that your multimeter is not that accurate, or the power supply is a little bit weak.
What power supply are you using? i.e. unregulated 12V AC 500mA? etc.
What do you measure for the 5V supply?
You should try to work out why you aren't getting closer to 9V (i.e. 8.95V or higher), but it's probably close enough to plug in SIDs and get sound out of them. This voltage check is more to make sure you have the JP header shunt installed correctly and won't fry your SIDs with anything higher than 9V. So don't worry too much.
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Cool!
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It could be a problem with the left SID socket.
Pin 8 on each socket is connected separately to the PIC, this is what enables each SID to receive data from the PIC, so if one SID isn't working then maybe this is why. Check pin 8 has continuity, not shorted, etc. Also check continuity of the filter caps (C1L, C2L), problems with these will result in no audio (I think), or at least no audio if the filter is enabled.
I've attached a PDF of the base PCB with ground plane turned off. This should have been in the wiki already, sorry. I blame nILS.
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1. I was joking.
2. sammichSID was designed to be the "no excuses" MIDIbox SID project. I wrote such comprehensive build instructions that even a complete newbie to electronics could build it. It even has photos of every part. Not having experience in soldering is not a valid excuse. So I would prefer people who have/will learn skills get kits ahead of people who just want to pay someone else, but ultimately people do what they want and I don't really care.
3. hexagonsun bought a kit already.
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Interesting... nice case idea.
What I don't understand is why the PCB in the "Quick Build" kit is a different PCB to the "Full Board Kit" kit.
MeeBlip Quick Build Kit
A MeeBlip anyone can play – with everything you need already in the box. No soldering required!
MeeBlip Full Board Kit
No case or overlays – suitable for those wanting to make their own enclosure. You solder the board yourself; some basic soldering experience recommended.
Note the extra "rear ports" PCB in the Quick Build kit. I think the MIDI and USB sockets are supposed to go on that PCB and not the bigger one, and then they stack via a male/female header.
So the Full Board kit doesn't have this rear ports PCB... therefore the MIDI socket will have to go on the same PCB, DIN sockets are max. 20mm high, so... how are you supposed to make your own case with a 20mm MIDI socket while the switches and pots are all short? You need something like a 7mm gap between PCB and top panel, and even then, the switch actuators would only poke out 2mm for a 3mm top panel. 7mm < 20mm. Hmm...
I suppose you could DIY your own rear ports PCB or use panel mount sockets... still, it's a shame that the kit aimed at hackers wanting to "make their own enclosure" are screwed over by the stoopid big fat MIDI socket on what is essentially the control surface PCB.
</rant> :D
Hmm... I wonder if people would be interested in a MIDIbox equivalent hackable DIY synth... with a sammich style case... hmmm... :wink:
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Paraphrase fail. It is actually (yes or (yes and no))
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Awesome! I'll reply to the questions for completeness...
But would this not also affect other registers?
Yes, but it might not be affecting the ones that count, or are audible. i.e. filter cutoff frequency might also be wrong, but you wouldn't notice unless you were doing slow filter sweeps.
Note also that the frequency is sent in two bytes, so both bytes of the register would be wrong, but you wouldn't have heard much difference in the low bits, and probably half the time, it wasn't wrong (i.e. it was a zero bit anyway).
Are the same Values for pitch used like here: http://archive.6502.org/datasheets/mos_6582_sid.pdf (Appendix A)?
Yes, but I think TK recalculated this table using the formula in the datasheet, as there are some rounding errors in the table, so what is in the firmware is not identical to the table.
I found out there is a correlation between the failing notes and the 11th databit!!!
hehehe I was going to check if there was, but it was late and finding a short would have proved the theory right a lot quicker. :wink:
Can I ask if you used the interconnection test to discover the short to ground, or just tested each pin with a multimeter to find out what was wrong?
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That's a very strange bug!
It is possible that one or more of the data lines to the SID are not working properly... so that most of the time things are working but you are noticing incorrect frequencies being written to the SID's data registers.
You could try the interconnection test:
http://www.ucapps.de/mios/mbsid_interconnection_test_v2.zip
to make sure the tracks between the 74HC595 and the SID are working correctly.
See the README.txt file inside the zip for instructions.
Check also there are no shorts between the pins on the SID sockets, and the 74HC595 below the SIDs.
Let's say there was a short, then in the case that both pins are outputting the same value (0V or 5V) then you wouldn't notice it, but when they are outputting different values, then they'd both be 0V, I'm guessing. Or could be something else depending on stuff I don't know about electronics (which is a lot). Either way, it might make some bit patterns still work fine, like most note frequencies in a given note range, and then be totally wrong all the time for some other note range.
You might want to test this theory by setting the pitch bend range to something large, and then hold a note down and do some pitch bending.... if you hear jumps in the pitch instead of a smooth glide, then the problem is definitely between the PIC/74HC595 and the SID and (most likely) nothing to do with the firmware or MIDI events being interpreted wrong, etc.
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To whoever bought an orange sammichSID T-shirt, congratulations, you're the first (other than nILS and myself).
BTW....
Red Bubble (the site where I've set up to sell T-shirts) just sent me a discount code. So until November 14th, use discount code Wilba_is_on_sale_3028 to get 15% off the price. That's a good deal, T-shirts are normally US$19.95 and they're good quality fabric and printing. Also, buy 4 T-shirts from Red Bubble and get free shipping (there are lots of other good T-shirt designs on Red Bubble, I'm not suggesting you get 4 of mine!)
I make no profit on these shirts, it's just for fun.
http://www.redbubble.com/people/wilba/t-shirts
Available in three printing colours, many fabric colours, long-sleeve, even hoodies.
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I'm not protecting this guy, I'm just stating facts.
Selling a one-off, custom made MIDIbox for any price is not an example of commercial intent. You don't know exactly how much this cost him to build in parts costs alone, paying customs duty to import some stuff (e.g. buying a panel from Schaeffer and then paying VAT/customs duty on it as well), or maybe how many C64s he had to buy just to get one working SID. Veroboard and wire is cheaper than a custom made control surface PCB, but that doesn't mean he should give it away.
I agree with TK... people are welcome to give opinions about these things, comment on whether it's overpriced or a bargain. I'm just saying there's no need to get so uptight about one-off sales and rant about breaking the rules.
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Stop getting your panties in a bunch.
Selling one MIDIbox on eBay is not considered breaking any non-commercial license.
Asking more than what you would be willing to pay doesn't change anything.
Before you start mouthing off about "intellectual property" and telling people they're "breaking rules", get your facts straight.
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So are you saying the LCD is now NOT working?
This could be related to a power supply problem.
Have you installed any SIDs yet?
Often if you have a slightly broken power supply, it can't supply enough power for 8 SIDs and everything else. If you have SIDs installed, remove them all and reboot, see if the LCD works again.
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I definitely sold you two fully tested 6582A SIDs.
The problem is most likely either a hardware fault on one channel, or what nILS said.
The easiest way to test if both SIDs are working and outputting on both channels is to use the default (init) Multi patch, check the "Mono" mode is off (in the Ensemble) and play some notes... the notes will be played using one oscillator from each of the SIDs, i.e. if you don't hold down more than one key at a time, notes will be output:
SID L, osc 1
SID L, osc 2
SID L, osc 3
SID R, osc 1
SID R, osc 2
SID R, osc 3
and on sammichSID, you'll also see which osc is being used by the LED matrix (like you said before, the right side will be lit for the right SID/channel).
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Heh. Yes, thatis the lötstelle 303 Transistor6 Sequencer. No case (yet). Has Midi AND CV out for sequencing and rocks as hell :-)
Looks like Jan finally got a case for it.
DSC02985 by janvanvolt, on Flickr
I kinda liked it better naked...
DSC02774 by janvanvolt, on Flickr
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Thanks. I wish I'd known a bit earlier, I could have recommended it to more people.
This is ideal if you want to use 6581, but also great for other SIDs because voltage is constant, keeping the heatsink cooler.
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OK... hmmm... maybe there is a short between the anode pad (which connects to the "row") and ground.
Let's say you're testing using a 5V/Ground from the MB-6582... then putting 5V on the anode of the LED (when in the PCB) might be shorting to ground instead of going through the LED and to ground via the LED cathode.
But that won't explain why other LEDs in that row work in isolation.
Can you take out the 74HC595 from the base PCB and try testing the LEDs by putting 5V into the IC socket pins which connect to JD7 and JD7 (via the resistors and resistor/transistors). i.e. simulate logic high outputs of the 74HC595. You may need to consult the PDF to show you which pins relate to JD7/JD8 pins.
Also, which LED in the bottom row is not working?
Does the rest of the bottom row work (when the app is running) when you take out the non-working LED?
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I believe "CS not enabled" is displayed only when the PIC is not the "master", the "master" PIC goes in the far right slot and should have ID=0, the other PICs should have ID=1, ID=2, ID=3.
Did you burn the bootloader yourself, or are these PICs from SmashTV?
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Is there a short between the two pads where this LED won't work? That would explain why it doesn't work.
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If the two "columns" of the switch matrix are shorted, then that would also explain the LEDs in that top group of 8 also being wrong... as it's a combined switch/LED matrix... the LED above each switch in that group has common cathodes connected to the same "column" as the switch.
I'm suggesting you look near the bottom row of the 8x8 LED matrix for shorts since that row of LEDs is also not working, but that could also be just a problem with the output for that row. You may be dealing with more than one problem here.
Check that none of the switch/LED matrix "column" pins/tracks are shorted to each other. These are the far left outputs, what connects to the 8 transistors on the base PCB. If you find a short between these, it might not be in that area, it could be elsewhere on the PCB.
oops I forgot to read your first post more carefully:
JD1 - D0 D1, D3 D4
JD2 - D0 D1 D2 D3
JD3 - D3 D4
JD4 - D2 D3 D4
JD8 - D6 D7
shorts on JD1, JD2, JD3, JD4 <-- expected behaviour. These connect directly to the encoders, and depending on the position, sometimes one or both of the encoder pins will be shorted to ground, therefore you will sometimes see both pins shorted with each other, through ground. Nothing to worry about, especially if the encoders are all working.
JD8 - D6 D7 <-- that's definitely the problem with the SID 1-4, Sync CC, Edit, Play switches/LEDs.
Can you check that these are not both shorting to ground as well?
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The "rules" which aren't clearly defined anywhere yet (we're working on it) are that MIDIbox is strictly non-commercial... meaning one-off sales of MIDIboxes built using "approved" PCBs/kits is OK. In other words, if you built it, you can do what you want. Common sense, really. But if you start producing many with the intent to profit, and then expect the MIDIbox community to support them, then that's "commercial" and against the "rules".
Personally, though, I don't care what people do with their sammichSID, and I care even less about someone who thinks their SidStation is worth keeping over the sammichSID :tongue: I'd be the first to admit the case is more pro-looking than the sammichSID but from a synth sound perspective, MIDIbox SID V2 with two 6582A vs. SidStation with one 6581? No contest. :thumbsup:
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US $224.10 shipping to Australia? WTF?
Meeblip
in Miscellaneous
Posted
I wasn't referring to sammichSID btw... that's not so hackable, really... well, someone could write different firmware but why bother? :wink:
I was thinking something more like the " synth.