Ableton Live Controller Design Thread

[joost_db]

I propose we start a thread to exchange ideas regarding the design of controllers for use with Ableton Live.  There seem to be alot of people here doing DIY jobs since there is such a lack of decent controllers for Live.

I realise that to some extent your design will be very personal and reflect how you use Live, but there will still be many similarities and ideas that can be exchanged.

I am currently planning the layout of my own Live controller.  It will be based on the midi section of a Xone 3D (see pic http://www.xone.co.uk/images/Hi-Rez/3D_top_overlays.jpg).  I will finish off the layout design and upload it along with button labels later today.

Joost

[joost_db]

53 pots

9 faders

57 buttons

50 leds

the design is fairly self explanatory (see labels on buttons).  the blue parts in the middle are pushbuttons with integrated leds (illuminating when a clip is playing), and the red parts on the bottom are pushbuttons with circular led lighting (illuminating what channels are sent to the headphones).  the scene control button can be used to navigate through live's scenes and pushed to launch the scene.  the top row of pots can be pushed to turn on/off the effect.

i am planning to route channel 1-4 to Send A and 5-8 to send B and then with the jog wheels i will be able to control the effects that are layered on the 2 returns.  this way instead of using effects on all the channels i am using only on the returns (with exceptions of course) which will save cpu power - and mimics the way a xone 92 mixer works.

anybody have any comments/ideas?

[Sasha]

Hey Joost, wellcome aboard. You chose nice reference for you design. Xone92 is one of the most seriously looking controlers. Very tasty and clean design. I have one sugestion regarding you design. I would rather mark the section "clip" than repeat so meny times Clip Lounch/Clip Mute/Clip stop. Visually looks bad. About other things I cant complain, as it suits individual needs, as you said.

Here is my vision of controller. It stil isn`t finished. I need to integrate the upgrade (immage 2) All coloured buttons are actualy laser cut/engraved opaque white acrylic with status LED in the background for signalisation.

[joost_db]

so there are a couple significant differences here.  first of all you are incorportaing a crossfader, which i was also thinking of doing, but then just opted to use only the upfaders of the individual channels.  why are you incorporating an x-fade?  is it when you are using the controller to mix mp3s together?

secondly you have 4 sends on each channel, how are you planning on using this kind of setup?  will you have control on effects parameters with this kind of design?

Joost

[tarzan boy]

this is really interesting to me as well. I dont have any of my own designs right now but I would love to start contributing to the brainstorm.

[joost_db]

also i like the metronome and tempo controls, i will add those to mine aswell.

for the scrub and left/right buttons, is that to synch up live to an already playing source such as a turntable?

[Sasha]

Strange. I`m sure I sucsessfully send answer yesterday... ???

I`ll repeat

I wanted to make CS for production and DJing from time to time, but with accent on production. That is why I want 4 sends per channel. Also, why not to have all Live`s MIDI map supported functions? It cost insignificantly more than without it. The worst thing is that you have to integrate it logically on the panel not taking too much space if you want it compact.

is that to synch up live to an already playing source such as a turntable?

No, it is for winding the trach for prewieving, finding cue points and such. I figured out you integrated same function in your controller (those 2 almost invisible jog weels) :)

But, how do you map them? That function is global for all clips. It works for focused clip as I remember. I tried that using LC emulation on Live 6, but it shouldn`t be anny difference.

[dengel]

Hi, everybody. Well, I have been building mine for a while, but (fortunately and unfortunately) my project was sidelined with the birth of my new daughter.

In any case, I am looking forward to finishing it up. A few months back, I met with an engineer friend, and he is making me re-do my technical drawings. He had crazy ideas of making the faceplate out of 1/4" aluminum plate, so a lot had to change, since instead of needing to simply make a hole, I now have to countersink my pots into the face so they can be screwed on :(. He's also having me measure every part with a micrometer so that everything is snug.

It's taking a long time, but other than that the project is still on. I've played live with the prototype a couple times and liked it, but it will be fun to have it done.

Hardest, most time consuming part of the entire project, in all honesty? Selecting buttons. Seriously, decent buttons are so hard to find it's almost stupid.

[joost_db]

Hardest, most time consuming part of the entire project, in all honesty? Selecting buttons. Seriously, decent buttons are so hard to find it's almost stupid.

Yes I know what you mean!  I am currently looking for pretty small push buttons with integrated LED lights and also a rotary encoder with push action built in...really hard to find.

p.s. here is a link to a modded xone 92 with midi functions for inspiration http://www.richiehawtin.com/CTRL/CTRL92RevA.swf

[ultra]

am i the only one here interested in making a seq customized for ableton live, or has someone already done this (and could share some pics and information)?  my idea would be to have all the seq v3 functions available, but also some kind of live control surface.  faders for 8-16 tracks in live, clip launch buttons, and also the ability to enable tracks for recording so at any time you can begin recording your sequence on a particular track.  live could be slaved to the seq and the seq's transport buttons could automatically send the control information.

an additional thought is to have 2 rows of 16 additional encoders that could send cc's to whatever parameters you assign them to in live.  my thought is to have a button on the seq that displays what parameters are controlled (you could input text and it would show up where the note information normally shows for your sequence.)  then there would be no question as to what parameter you are controlling.  you can simply hit the button that changes the display to show your parameters (first row of 16 encoders along the first line of the display, second on the second).  perhaps different configurations you use could be saved and when you call one up, the text for your setup returns to the seq/control surface.

is any of this possible or am i just hoping?

drew

[Resident-RobB]

So, this is the ableton controller I'm currentjly working on.

I've received all of the components, and 'the deckplates wille be ordered this week.

As you probably can see, I am using the xone 3d ieda, only the basis of this project my Ecler NUO4 mixer. All the fader caps and potmeters I am using are original Ecler parts, so the unit will have a nica an finished look!

[ultra]

how are you guys making these panel designs?  from scratch in photoshop?

[Resident-RobB]

I am using the frontplatt designer from Schaeffer-AG.de

The initial design I made in a CAD program.

[Sasha]

I wouldn`t sugest using Photoshop for designing panels as it is made for bitmap graphics, not vector.

Friend designed his box using Photoshop, and I needed to rebuild hole thing in Corel Draw as vector so it can be send to CNC service. You need to have ability to numerically change dimensions, to align objects, etc. The output file is usable on anny CNC machine. I am mostly using laser cutter. Panel on picture is designed in Corel Draw and it is waterjet cut. The result is precisely cut 1mm thick steel. It is waiting to be airbrushed and screen printed.

This is the original design

[joost_db]

wow you guys are CNC milling your faceplates???  I was planning to just manually drill holes in a piece of aluminium.

i do however have access to a cnc machine at my university so i may be able to use....could i design the front panel in illustrator?  would a cnc machine accept that type of vector file?

[dengel]

You could save it as a dxf in illustrator, which a CNC machinist could use. I hand-drilled a plate, and it works OK but I am looking for a more finished look.

[kris]

    ive used illustrator before as you say dxf files ask the person whos running the cnc as they might be able to help with program  hand cutting is fine but slots for sliders are areal pain

[Sasha]

Man, don`t drill it, mill it! I would never made those boring fader stripes by hand again, NEVER! I use my hands only for things I cannot do easier way.

Sure, Illustrator, Freehand whatever... vector is vector. As already said, maybe you should save your draving as DXF or something else. Check what they use. Pay attention on lines width. It must be hairline for cutting!

Here are the buttons in place i had to sanded with sandpaper, and fill it with paint... They are laser cut, but still there are alot of work. You just can`t avoid using hands, but you can minimise it.

[stryd_one]

I was planning to just manually drill holes in a piece of aluminium.

i do however have access to a cnc machine at my university

Madman! Use the CNC! ;)

[dengel]

Here are the buttons in place i had to sanded with sandpaper, and fill it with paint... They are laser cut, but still there are alot of work. You just can`t avoid using hands, but you can minimise it.

Sasha - WHERE ARE THOSE BUTTONS FROM?

[Sasha]

Dengel, they are from my head  ;)

Check http://www.midibox.org/forum/index.php?topic=8417.0

[rambinator]

Hi!

I also have a steelfrontplate laying around here for my MBLC. What sort of Artwork are you planing to use? What would stick to the steel?

[Sasha]

You can see the artwork on the page 1 of this topic. ;) Do you have some pics of your panel?

[rambinator]

Oh, yes I saw the artwork. Great design! I meant how you want to bring it to your panel... engraving, lazertran, etching...?

I thought i didn't want to post pictures until i am ready, but... well i'm gonna start my own thread when the box is finished.

this is the backside of the panel. it is kinda messed. the frontside is still protected by a stickyfoil and it is shiny.

this is what the different panels look like fitted into the case i built.

inside the box...

the design isnt ready yet... i do it in coreldraw. my main problem is how i should bring it onto the panel as i heard so many different things about stuff and varnish stickin/not sticking to ss

[Triple-J]

@joost_db:

how did you designed your xone based panel? and how did you put in the ableton logo?

and how do you want to navigate the scenes?

I'm thinking of making an ableton controller with buttens for every single scene, 16 tracks and at least 8 scenes/track so that will be already 128 buttons(oops), that would be to mutch buttons maybe... But I think the positve thing with 128 buttons is, you don't have to navigate so much....?

Maybe it's a stupid idea, or got a better idea?