Juno-60 reinkarnation

[Sasha]

History repeating... as don`t have all the parts to finish my almost finished 9090. I`ve decided to put some attention to my dust gathering Juno-60. I bought it from a Gypsy on a local flea market long time ago in not so perfect shape. Until few days ago it was gathering dust in my basement. There were mising some slider knobs, button caps, few keys are burned with cigarette, few key contacts and pots are busted too... a list goes on. The metal part of casing is rusty, and wooden cheeks are damaged, so not much of it`s outer beauty left, but it`s soul is fine. As I`m not a keyboard player but midiboxer, I couldn`t accept gear I cannot control externally with MIDI, so my old plan was to MIDI-fy it and to give it a new body.

This is how it looked when I got it. On this picture it don`t look so bad. :)

As it was in basement for a some time it gathers a dust even more than it was, so I thought only way out is blowing it with compressor.

I really expected better results, but it is covered in some mixture of dust, dirt and everything else... so blowing it didn`t gave expected results. You can see main board in all it`s shine and glory.  :P

I was surprised that control surface boards looks much better. This picture I took after dusting.

As already mentioned this synth I bought from Gypsy, and Gypsies music has a lot of "bending". This is the result of hard core usage. I conclude this Gypsy has very sweaty hands.  :P

Before I dismantled it I tried it for a last time to make sure it still works.

Juno-60 has 3 big boards. 2 CS PCBs and one main board. Main board is widest of all and it will direct me the width of the synth. I`m planing to mount the boards on the separate shelves one of top of other to make this synth as compact as possible.

This is left control surface board. I decided it would be much cheaper to use roto pots instead of sliders. Sliders are also harder to get for me locally.

These old PCBs are really fragile. I didn`t wanted to damage the traces trying to desolder the mechanical parts, so I cut the leads off. I left switches alone as they don`t make any connection when depressed so I can just solder the wires in parallel to them.

This I/O board looks pretty dirty too, so I`ll probably make another one or mount the those jacks to back panel.

I don`t have any service manual nor schematic for Juno, so I needed to lable the connections so I can put it back again.

This keyboard is pretty nice. The keys are big and have nice feeling. I`m not planing to keep integrated keyboard. I will probably shorten it to just 3 octaves and use the rest of keys to replace those burned by cigarette. This keyboard will be connected to MIDIO128 and become nice master keyboard. :)

It is connected as 8x8 matrix. I suppose all keyboards are connected that way.

[Futureman]

Hey Sasha, I've got a Juno 60's service manual floating around..

I do dig my J60.. It's a shame your chopping it up, but seeing the quality of your work, I'm sure it's gonna be tops.

The Juno 6 / 60 piss all over a Juno 106.. I don't understand why people drool over 106's.. it's probably because they have Midi, but sonically, the 6 & 60 are monsters compared to the boring 106.

Good quality chorus inside the Juno60.. if you are getting real busy with hacking it up, see if you can add an input to it.

Regards

Mike

[Sasha]

Mike, If I can restore it to the original shape for cheap I would, but it is pretty damaged. I hope I`ll have some decent housing results worth Juno-60.

What kind of input are you talking about? MIDI. I know DCB is kind of MIDI but I don`t believe I could just hook up MIDI to it. If you have any tip how to MIDIfi it cheaper (I`m going with reed relays) I would be grateful.

In what condition is your Juno? If you need some cosmetics or button domes, I could send you for free. Here is what I`ve got...

volume knob is damaged, rest is pretty fine. I cleaned it all.

This offer worth for the other too. ;)

[Sasha]

quoting myself from flikr

I asked my mother to recommend me something to clean some greasy and very dirty parts and she gave me this spray for cleaning oven. I sprayed it and came after some time. Maaan, It was magic! The dirt like is eaten alive. : ) I prepared myself for long scrubbing, but what I did... I just slightly washed it out with dish detergent and cold water. And that is how I discovered my favorite chemical (besides ferochloride)

I was so happy to see the result. I can say it is pretty aggressive to the fats so hands started to be very slippery in touch to it... like it is reacting on skin oils. It do take some cautious handling ,preferably with gloves. I guess it is designed especially for oils and fats. I tried it with different kind of metals and plastics and it don`t damage the material at all, just dirt which is very important!

I Highly recommend oven cleaner for vintage synth parts!

[Futureman]

Thanks Sasha, but my Juno60's pretty much in mint condition.

I actually meant an audio input into the chorus circuit.. It's rolands famous chorus, which many guitarists seem to like.

Yep, DCB kinda sucks.. I do have an MSQ-700 which, while that does not convert from midi to DCB, lets me sequence it if I want, and can be clocked from Midi or Din Sync.

Reeds would be a 'brute force' way of midi-ing it I guess.. There used to be a seller selling MIDI->DCB DCB->MIDI converters, but I don't see any now.

Are you keeping the keyboard? Or gonna rack mount it?

A Midibox midification of a Juno60 would be super (Using it's key matrix), but I think the target audience would be to small for it to ever get off the ground, And it's beyond the scope of my abilities right now.

I also have a STUPID amount of the DCB connectors.. some farmer in the states sold a whole box to me when I could not source a DCB lead... If you want a few Sasha, Let me know.

Regards

Mike

[Futureman]

Oven cleaner is pretty dangerous stuff... My ex got the most nasty chemical burns on her arm from that stuff.

For cleaning keys , or mixer knobs, I throw them in a bucket of hot water with few splashes of 'Spray and wipe' and wait for half an hour.

Regards

Mike

[Sasha]

I actually meant an audio input into the chorus circuit.. It's rolands famous chorus, which many guitarists seem to like.

I didn`t know it is famous, especially among the guitarists, but I really like how it sounds. Having it available for external audio would be just great!  :D

There used to be a seller selling MIDI->DCB DCB->MIDI converters, but I don't see any now.

There are some converters available but I cannot afford it. I expect reeds and MB would be cheaper way. I just need to figure out how to hook the 16 reed relays and emulate the matrix instead of having 61 relay :o

I know button/LED matrix is the answer but I`m really far from ability to customize the code for my needs. I must relay on ready made MB solutions.

I was thinking of stealing the D0-D7 signal across the diodes and join it to one connection that is connected to the 9th relay so for each register relay activated in pair to the individual outputs. I have to do some tests to know is it plausible. It must sounds funny to you programmers I`m trying this way.  :-[

Are you keeping the keyboard? Or gonna rack mount it?

Not with Juno. I`ll make shorter version of master keyboard out of it. Probably 3 octaves as I have some damaged keys and contacts to have full, 5 octaves version. I really like the keyboard!

A Midibox midification of a Juno60 would be super (Using it's key matrix), but I think the target audience would be to small for it to ever get off the ground, And it's beyond the scope of my abilities right now.

Yes, that would be great, but I guess I have to go the harder and more expensive way. Those reed relays arn`t very cheap, but MOS photo relays sneakthief used for his Jen SX1000 are also pretty expensife as you really need it a lot. :(

I also have a STUPID amount of the DCB connectors.. some farmer in the states sold a whole box to me when I could not source a DCB lead... If you want a few Sasha, Let me know.

Thanks for the offer but I wan`t be need it as I wan`t be needing DCB port itself.

Oven cleaner is pretty dangerous stuff... My ex got the most nasty chemical burns on her arm from that stuff.

I know, so that is why I cautious. I dont have to touch the keys anway. I just spray it, shake it and left still for some time and that wash it out using shower.

[stryd_one]

Yeh I had a roland chorus back in the day when I didn't play synths yet, and they are highly regarded.. They don't sound at all 'realistic' but they do have a nice... somethingness :)

Nice on drums too, wink wink.

[cimo]

And that is how I discovered my favorite chemical

maaan it took you a while uh? me with 18 i already knew it

[Sasha]

...and you kept it for yourself only. you bastard. ;)

[stryd_one]

Let's get him!

[Sasha]

Even this is kind of separate project, I`ll be posting here about making the master keyboard as the keyboard was part of Juno once and I`m running both projects in parallel.

This keyboard rig needs some hard core sanding and I`m awaiting some better weather so I can do it outside. It is pretty badly eaten by rust.

[rvlt]

Hey Sasha,

just wanted to let you know I midified my Roland Juno 6 with a midibox circuit and reed relays. I "cloned" the breadboard layout which TK used to midify a Korg PS3000, I only used more relays (61 at all).

It works (well, at least 98% of the time, there is some strange behavior when you press certain combinations of keys, but anyway...), but ...

... it was a lot of work and expensive! I paid well above 100,- euros. As you said before, reed relays aren't cheap.

If I had a Juno 60 with a DCB port, I would certainly go for a DCB interface. There's one from engineers@work which costs about 89,- euros. If it works as advertised, you can't go wrong with it.

Although your project looks really interesting, it's always sad to see working juno got ripped apart. They are such good sounding and well layout synths...

Anyway, happy modding and let us know the results.

cheers.

[rvlt]

Ah, one more thing:

Before I built the reed relay board, I thought I could just use an interface which "hijacks" or "mimics" the signals from the 8x8 scanning matrix (without having to use a relay for every single key).

So I tried the UMR from highly liquid, but unfortunately it didn't work. In theory such "emulator" could work, but in this case the scanning speed an pulselengths were different, so had to go the expensive route...

----

I don't have a camera right now, but I could take some pics of the relay-board in the next few days if you are interested

cheers

[Sasha]

just wanted to let you know I midified my Roland Juno 6 with a midibox circuit and reed relays. I "cloned" the breadboard layout which TK used to midify a Korg PS3000, I only used more relays (61 at all).

It works (well, at least 98% of the time, there is some strange behavior when you press certain combinations of keys, but anyway...), but ...

Strange... did you connect everything right? Is that strange behavior happen whan you press same key configuration? Have you separated matrix right?

... it was a lot of work and expensive! I paid well above 100,- euros. As you said before, reed relays aren't cheap.

If I had a Juno 60 with a DCB port, I would certainly go for a DCB interface. There's one from engineers@work which costs about 89,- euros. If it works as advertised, you can't go wrong with it.

89 EUR is not so much mut for me it is too much. I payed this Juno 80EUR and relays would cost me about 40EUR which is more than half price of the CDB interface. A friend offered to make a parser for DCB... we`ll see will we succeed. It we fail, there are always simplest solution - relays. ;)

Although your project looks really interesting, it's always sad to see working juno got ripped apart. They are such good sounding and well layout synths...

I don`t agree... it is sad to see dust gathering Juno in bad shape. Seeing it ripped apart gives some hope it will sing again. :)

Anyway, happy modding and let us know the results.

You`re on a right place to see the results. ;)

[Sasha]

Yesterday weather let me to use my rooftop for some metal works.

I shorten this key holder by 2 octaves. It was 5 before. I wouldn`t do it if gypsy player wasn`t hard core smoker (he burned few keys badly).

This is the results of few minute work with grinder with sandpaper disk. Easy done, very satisfied. :)

As this obviously isn`t stainless steel I sprayed it with car primer. I`t will be left as is. There will be no other paint layers on top.

Good thing is that primer was fast drying as weather changed again... rain. :(

[/tilted/]

Love it!

Very nice work as always Sasha.

Do be careful (everyone) with the oven cleaner. - That 'slippery' sensation is the result of a process called "hydrolysis", and essentially, the oven cleaner is turning the oils in your skin (and by extension, your skin itself, since it is supported by the oils) into soap. Nasty.

[Ashiman]

Yeh I had a roland chorus back in the day when I didn't play synths yet, and they are highly regarded.. They don't sound at all 'realistic' but they do have a nice... somethingness :)

Nice on drums too, wink wink.

one could battle transient smearing though somehow! I too have a few of these mn3004 chips 512 stage BBD. Made me think about the transient issue on percussive stuff, VCA-s should work IMHO, I think I go modular  :P

[Sasha]

Thanks titled.

I figured out slippery hands can mean just one thing... my hands are dissolving. I washed it right away so it didn`t cose me any injury. Chemistry can be pretty dangerous if you don`t know what you are doing and what dangers are, but experimentation is in my blood and I do take some risks from time to time. Just think... Albert Hofman didn`t discovered LSD just by watching the lysergic acid.  He needed to lick it. And if he didn`t his bike ride would never be so fun. :P

[stryd_one]

LOL.  If you want to see if it gets you high, eat it... If you want to see if it washes your skin, rub it in... If you want to see if it cleans metal... Wear goggles, a mask, and gloves, and employ an extraction fan. Much harder to rinse the vapour out of your eyes or lungs.

And always follow the safety precautions (printed on the side of the can?). They're not there because the company likes you, they're there because they're afraid someone will fuck themselves up and sue them. We don't care about the law suit but we care about you getting fucked up.

That said, you know I have that experimental spirit too, and you know about my first experience with HV caps. We all do dumb things sometimes. I guess it adds adventure to our geeky lives ;) Still, if you wanna seem like a badass and get the girls, I'd recommend a leather jacket torn jeans and a red electric guitar, over a chemical lung scrub. But my oven-cleaning gloves are pink rubber, so WTF would I know about that :D

[Sasha]

Stryd, just because I said how it reacted with skin on my hands doesn`t mean I washed these keys with naked hands while sniffing the fumes in small non-ventilated room. I am experimenter, but I`m certainly not stupid nor I`m acting like a tough guy. I have no problem wearing pink gloves, but If I`m using hands.

[Sasha]

[stryd_one]

Don't sweat it bro, that was 10% serious lesson (which is mostly aimed not at you, but at <insert newbie's nick here>) and 90% jokes :)

[julienvoirin]

I payed this Juno 80EUR

lucky bastard  ;)

i want one too, but it is 800 euros in Paris !

[Sasha]

I don`t believe it would cost 800 EUR if you found on in bad shape as mine. For the one in bad shape, if t could be the fair price. It also depends from whom you are buying and where. I used to go to the local flea market regularly, and surprises happens sometimes. Also, I never buy from the white people! Only from Gypsyes. Way cheaper for the same thing and they are willing to negotiate. I bought almost all my C64 on a flea market (about 30). So when Gypsy see me, and have one, they start shouting... hey bro, I have another keyboard (C64) for you! :)