tago

Note Off events missing (inverted Note On/Off events)

29 posts in this topic

Posted (edited)

Hi,

i've encountered an issue while testing my keyboard controller.

The output in MIOS Studio shows correct note on/off (key pressed down = on, key released = off) events, but when i'm testing on a separate music computer running Cubase those events seem inverted (on -> off and off -> on)

Cubase MIDI monitor shows something like this on a single C3 press:

Note On   C3   0
Note On   C3   127

It looks like Note Off events are missing and strange 0 events are triggered before Note On.

I've no idea what is causing that.

 

Edit: The solution was to change the USB port or reinsert the USB cable.

Edit 2: The problem is unfortunately still there.

Edited by tago

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Here is my config. Jumper J6 on DIO_MATRIX module is set to the left position (inverted diodes).

KEYBOARD n=1   rows=8  dout_sr1=1  dout_sr2=2  din_sr1=1  din_sr2=2  din_inverted=1  break_inverted=0  din_key_offset=32 \
               scan_velocity=1  scan_optimized=0  note_offset=36 \
               delay_fastest=5  delay_fastest_black_keys=0  delay_slowest=100

 

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Posted (edited)

A Note On with a 0 velocity is always considered as a Note Off by most of midi gear, this is for the running status, to avoid its constantly change, and optimize the midi traffic.
Are you sure Cubase receives 0 velocity first?

Edited by Antichambre

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Thanks for your help @Antichambre

Yes, i tested it carefully. It can also be heard when playing a VSTi. Frist i thought there were hanging notes. But now it looks like Note On and Off events are simply inverted, which results in a similiar scenario.

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Try with with an other midi monitor like midiOx(pc) or snoize(mac) depending on your separate music computer. And share the result...

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Posted (edited)

I noted another strange thing.

When i press C3 for the first time after opening Cubase i see multiple Note On 0 events with different note values fired. There is no C3 0 event, only the last C3 127 event.

Note On   E1   0
Note On   F1   0
Note On   F#1  0
Note On   G1   0
Note On   G#3  0
Note On   A2   0
Note On   A#3  0
Note On   B3   0
Note On   C3   127

After the first C3 press, there are only two events fired per key press as described in the opening post.

Edit: this happens only sometimes

Edited by tago

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I've swapped the MIDIBox controller with another MIDI keyboard and everthing looks fine in Cubase MIDI monitor. It sends Note On and Note Off events as expected.

Besides MIDI-OX outputs everything as expected for both of my controllers. MIDI-OX output looks exactly like MIOS studio output.

So there is something wrong when using the MIDIBox controller with Cubase. But what the hell is it?

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Posted (edited)

Try also to desactive MIDI THRU in cubase midi settings...

And if your midibox has regular MIDI and you own a midi interface try with it instead of USB directly.

Note: if your're connected with usb there's no running status then Note Off must be received.
Running status is only for regular midi connection(DIN) and MIOS studio marks the Note Off as "optimized" when it's the case.
 

Edited by Antichambre

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Disabling MIDI thru in Cubase preferences results in no MIDI input at all.

My controller has no regular MIDI ports to test with, USB only.

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Just now, tago said:

Disabling MIDI thru in Cubase preferences results in no MIDI input at all.

Yes this is disabling midi monitoring too, this can't help.

it seems you're not alone I found more than 10 threads like this:
https://www.steinberg.net/forums/viewtopic.php?t=117590

Unfortunately I didn't read any concrete solution.
 

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Posted (edited)

It seems is not an exclusive Cubase problem since NI Absynth in standalone does exactly the same thing (Note On/Off inverted).

Edit:

I've tested it on another computer, which also runs Windows 10, using SAVIHost running Synth1 with no issues.

Edited by tago

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I think i found the culprit.

I've changed the USB port and now it works.

Regardless i'd like to know what the underlying problem is. I've never encountered such a problem in conjunction with a MIDI keyboard before.

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USB midi driver maybe and try all others USB ports.

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I changed it back to the original USB port and now it works there too.

Maybe the cable was not correctly inserted? But that doesn't explain why MIDI-OX showed the correct MIDI data all the time.

Very strange.

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You're welcome, you can mark this topic as [SOLVED] ;)

Best regards
Bruno

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Yeah its kind of solved. I mean the inverted On/Off behaviour is really strange.

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Posted (edited)

I know a guy I used to work with who can't touch any computer because they hang. Yep it's strange sometimes ;)

Edited by Antichambre

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It was not all the time but more than other people for sure, electrostatic thing maybe, we never knew.

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Unfortunately the problem is still there.

I had to change the USB port again, after getting inverted on/off events.

I've no idea what is causing this. What could be the culprit?

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I could locate the problem to a point after some further testing.

It has nothing to do with changing the USB port. Simply removing and plugging the cable into the same USB port again solves it when the computer is already running.

The problem occurs after every system boot when the pc was disconnected from the mains before. But what can possibly go wrong in that scenario? I never encountered such a problem with any USB device before.

Has anyone an idea what to check or why it happens? Maybe it somehow power related?

 

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I remember that I encountered that a few times too already. All digital signals where inverted after system boot. So also buttons that were connected to the midibox didn't sent 127 when pressed but 0 and the keyboard did the same. 

I never solved this. Maybe @TK. has an idea. 

Did you try to set fastboot on in the bootloader? I think that was my workaround...

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38 minutes ago, FantomXR said:

I remember that I encountered that a few times too already. All digital signals where inverted after system boot. So also buttons that were connected to the midibox didn't sent 127 when pressed but 0 and the keyboard did the same. 

I never solved this. Maybe @TK. has an idea. 

Did you try to set fastboot on in the bootloader? I think that was my workaround...

The motherboard doesn't have an option for fastboot. It's an older Asus P8Z68-V Pro. I've changed some USB settings, but no luck with that.

I tried this: https://help.uaudio.com/hc/en-us/articles/213195423-How-To-Disable-Fast-Startup-in-Windows-10

But this didn't do the trick either.

Really strange. I don't know what else i could try.

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