Jaicen Posted September 17, 2006 Report Share Posted September 17, 2006 I know this might seem a stupid thing to say, but has anyone ever tried modifying the MBSEQ to work like a TB-303? I understand that it's a more powerful tool, and can do way more than the 303 ever could, but I have a peculiar liking for that weird little box, and I know i'll never own one. What I'd like, is something that has 13 note buttons (C-C), transpose + & -, etc.. Basically all the buttons the 303 has so it can be programmed in the same way. No velocity, just accent so a single track seq would be fine. Pattern select, and things can be handled with an LCD and encoder (see, i'm not a luddite ;) ).In my ideal world, the sequencer would be allied to a an integrated SID core, with the patches accessible from the 2x20 LCD.Of course it's never going to materialise, but does anyone else share my secret fetish?? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr modnaR Posted September 17, 2006 Report Share Posted September 17, 2006 [showing off] nah mate, i've got a x0xb0x ;D [/showing off] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jaicen Posted September 17, 2006 Author Report Share Posted September 17, 2006 Bastard. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bill Posted September 17, 2006 Report Share Posted September 17, 2006 has anyone ever tried modifying the MBSEQ to work like a TB-303? IThis could be a very interesting MB user project !! (better than a modification of the MBSEQ)I would love to work on this, but i definitely need to have a 303 in my hand to know how it works (and some time for doing it ;) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DrBunsen Posted September 17, 2006 Report Share Posted September 17, 2006 Doesn't the MBSID 303 firmware have a sequencer in it? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr modnaR Posted September 18, 2006 Report Share Posted September 18, 2006 not sure on the original, but the x0xb0x certainly does, which leads me to believe that there was no downloadable firmware available. i may be wrong though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stryd_one Posted September 18, 2006 Report Share Posted September 18, 2006 I've got the reverse problem, I always wanted a 303 clone minus all the sequencing stuff so I could just use an MBSEQ and still get that nice sound :) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jaicen Posted September 18, 2006 Author Report Share Posted September 18, 2006 Well, Stryd, that's certainly a much easier propostion! The 303 is all analogue goodness, so it would be a relatively simple task to homebrew a clone of the voice board, and interface it to an MBSID CV controller or something. It's something that i'd be interested in, but considering how close the 8580 can get to the sound of the 303, it seems like we're re-inventing the wheel ;) That said, i'd love a real 303 of course! Bill, I've never owned a real 303 either. I saw one in a studio once and was shocked at how small it is! It was sat on a Jupiter 8, so the scale may have been a bit misleading..;)Anyway, the only time i've ever used the 303 type sequencer, is with the Prophet64.com software. That stuff sounds great, and does pretty much everything a 303 does, but doesn't have the ability to chain patterns into songs. It's not really well suited to live use either, but if it's functionality could be copied in hardware form, i'd be a happy bunny! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr modnaR Posted September 18, 2006 Report Share Posted September 18, 2006 I've got the reverse problem, I always wanted a 303 clone minus all the sequencing stuff so I could just use an MBSEQ and still get that nice sound :)strange i'd kinda expected you to have one of the many kits available. ahh well, i'll have to get my Ozdar recalibrated. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stryd_one Posted September 18, 2006 Report Share Posted September 18, 2006 I've got the password for the x0xb0x and just waiting for the next production run :) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr modnaR Posted September 18, 2006 Report Share Posted September 18, 2006 being as you don't want the sequencer, why not go for just a module clone? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Altitude Posted September 18, 2006 Report Share Posted September 18, 2006 why not go for just a module cloneCheck out the oakley 3031. Good stuff Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TK. Posted September 18, 2006 Report Share Posted September 18, 2006 Emulating TB303 sequences completely via MIDI is mostly not possible, because synths normaly don't provide a way to change the pitch to a new note and to activate the slide without triggering the gate.See also http://www.ucapps.de/howto_sid_bassline.html, example for the Code "26"Such a function can be partly simulated by dynamically switching between mono and legato mode via CC, but the implementation depends heavily on the capabilities of the target synth.Best Regards, Thorsten. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Altitude Posted September 18, 2006 Report Share Posted September 18, 2006 The way this is implemented on the x0xb0x, MAM MB33, and IIRC the 3031 is that the synth looks for note off events. If it sees one it shuts the gate, if not then it slides from one note to another without shutting the gate so in an external sequencer, you just need to have the note that its slides from "go" beyond the start of the note it slides into. The x0x will actually send out midi slides like this alsoEmulating TB303 sequences completely via MIDI is mostly not possible, because synths normaly don't provide a way to change the pitch to a new note and to activate the slide without triggering the gate.See also http://www.ucapps.de/howto_sid_bassline.html, example for the Code "26"Such a function can be partly simulated by dynamically switching between mono and legato mode via CC, but the implementation depends heavily on the capabilities of the target synth.Best Regards, Thorsten. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jaicen Posted September 18, 2006 Author Report Share Posted September 18, 2006 To be honest, i'm not looking for something that will fool anyone who knows about the 303, just something that has a similar functionality. I've got a DX27 and i'm getting a JX3P, both of which i'm using live, and i'd like to have some sequenced stuff to in there as well. It's just an idea at the minute, but i've got a spare SID i'd like to use for a dedicated x0x b0x type of thing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Altitude Posted September 18, 2006 Report Share Posted September 18, 2006 I dont know what a monophonic sequencer like the 303's would give you since both those synths are polyphonic and the DX is a 4 op FM synth (no analog goodness there). the JX should better but it has very limited midi control so a variable portamento controlled via midi may not be possible. It would need to be controlled like TK mentioned Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TK. Posted September 18, 2006 Report Share Posted September 18, 2006 The way this is implemented on the x0xb0x, MAM MB33, and IIRC the 3031 is that the synth looks for note off events. If it sees one it shuts the gate, if not then it slides from one note to another without shutting the gate so in an external sequencer, you just need to have the note that its slides from "go" beyond the start of the note it slides into. The x0x will actually send out midi slides like this alsoin MBSID, this mode is called "SusKey", the functionality in other words: slide will be activated when two notes are overlapping. In MBSEQ, slides are activated in the same way.But this doesn't give you all possibilities, because when you are using this technique, you cannot indepedently control if on a slided note the gate should be retriggered (or not), or that the note should be accented.Best Regards, Thorsten. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jaicen Posted September 18, 2006 Author Report Share Posted September 18, 2006 I didn't mean to imply that I would use the seq to trigger either of my synths, as I said before I want a dedicated sequencer & sound module (SEQ + MBSID). That way I can have it running while I play the keyboards. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TK. Posted September 18, 2006 Report Share Posted September 18, 2006 Why do you want to build a MBSEQ, when MBSID V2 will provide a dedicated control surface extension for TB303 mode? See also the bottom of this page: http://www.ucapps.de/midibox_sid_v2_wishlist.htmlBest Regards, Thorsten. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jaicen Posted September 19, 2006 Author Report Share Posted September 19, 2006 I did write to you a few months back about the TB mode, but you told me to wait until V2 was released for more details. Therefore, i've no idea how you plan to implement the control surface for the sequencer, or how pattern writing will be accomplished. Will the note events be MIDI notes that can be recorded by an external sequencer?? What I really need to know is if your control extension will allow me to build a self contained 303 workalike. If so, then this thread is reduntant I guess. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stryd_one Posted September 19, 2006 Report Share Posted September 19, 2006 Check out the oakley 3031. Good stuffThanks man that's a good tip. I like that they've done a beefed up kinda-clone. I always wanted something that sounded like a 303 if you wanted it to, but with like 3 oscillators and two multimode filters and a few envelopes and lfos .... This isn't quite that, but its as close as I can find ;) I'm not usually a sucker for certain bits of kit, but there's no denying 'that' sound .... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TK. Posted September 19, 2006 Report Share Posted September 19, 2006 I did write to you a few months back about the TB mode, but you told me to wait until V2 was released for more details. Therefore, i've no idea how you plan to implement the control surface for the sequencer, or how pattern writing will be accomplished. Will the note events be MIDI notes that can be recorded by an external sequencer?? What I really need to know is if your control extension will allow me to build a self contained 303 workalike. If so, then this thread is reduntant I guess. I haven't spent any additional thoughts on this yet, as you propably know, I'm currently working on MBSEQ V3 and this requires my full concentration. Any statement I give now could be obsolete 2 months later, when I get ideas for even more powerfull MBSID V2 features - when you follow the progress of MBSEQ V3, then you know what I mean.It wouldn't be a big problem to add a feature which allows to send MIDI Notes out, this even could already be integrated into MBSID V1 by adding some lines of code into the sid_wt.inc functions...For the control surface I don't think that it will exactly look like the one of TB303, because I don't find it erconomic. If you are searching for a 1:1 TB303 sequencer clone, then I cannot help here, because I'm not interested in such a project.You could have a look into this forum: http://19642.forendienst.de/index.php, where such a DIY sequencer is documented.Best Regards, Thorsten. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jaicen Posted October 29, 2006 Author Report Share Posted October 29, 2006 I forgot all about this thread! Thanks for the link TK, but I'm afraid i can't read any of the stuff posted since I don't speak the language.I've just re-read what I wrote and it seems that it's not terribly clear. What i'd like to build, is a 16 step sequencer, with SID built in. The sid would be controlled by the sequencer in MONO. Initially I thought that i'd just add a control surface A to the synth, but now I think i'd prefer to have the classic TB knob arrangement, ie. Cutoff, Resonance, Env, Decay, Accent and maybe have the SID in TB mode all the time. I don't really understand what TK was saying about the slide thing, but how difficult would it be to program an app like this up?? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TK. Posted October 29, 2006 Report Share Posted October 29, 2006 It's not that difficult, but if somebody builds up such an application from scratch, I would estimate a working effort of ca. 6 months - considered, that he knows about MIDI and embedded programming, but never implemented a sequencer before...If somebody thinks, he could do this in less time, than hands up!Best Regards, Thorsten. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jaicen Posted October 30, 2006 Author Report Share Posted October 30, 2006 To be honest, I could live without MIDI, as long as it can sync to an incoming S24 or MIDI clock that's all I need. I guess there are a lot of people here with lofty ideas, and not the skill to implement them! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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