matrigs Posted February 26, 2008 Report Posted February 26, 2008 so i am very afraid now. as some of you could read in a bunch of my topics in the last week - i had some major problems with all m midibox projects lately and weird, totall random bugs. yesterday i realised that the only thing that i have changed in midiboxing during the last weeks is my torch - i bought a new one and suddenly everything god out of control.all of my soldered din boards seem dead. interconnections are fine though. so it seems the chips are dead. that made me think.is it possible that my torch might be a chip killer ? Quote
dj3nk Posted February 27, 2008 Report Posted February 27, 2008 you are using a torch ?????? no soldering iron ???? i am using a torch for building water pipes ;) Quote
nILS Posted February 27, 2008 Report Posted February 27, 2008 Do you solder the ICs directly to the board w/o headers?Are there any specs for you new torch which I really hope is a soldering iron? Quote
matrigs Posted February 27, 2008 Author Report Posted February 27, 2008 yeah i already changed the subject - of course an iron.it's like one of those more professional "stations" where you have a base with an iron holder and a heat-regulator. it has stickers all over it with some passed atests and so on. Quote
nILS Posted February 27, 2008 Report Posted February 27, 2008 What temperature is the station set to? How long to you have to heat up the pins? Quote
matrigs Posted February 27, 2008 Author Report Posted February 27, 2008 i don't have a meter just a unscaled pot. it has 50 watts but i use around half of it. i am very careful when soldering chips without sockets and try to heat up the legs only shortly. but i guess temperature isn't an issue - before that i had a 40watt unregulated iron and no problems with it altough it burned tin like hell.are grounding problems possible? for example might it be that the plug in my wall is ungrounded ? Quote
cimo Posted February 27, 2008 Report Posted February 27, 2008 hi matrigsi am happy to see that you are not using a torch! i am having the same problem.. maybe you got your ICs at Conrad? 74hc165E (73C41MN) ?I was wondering if they could be defective/more sensible to heat than normal..simone Quote
matrigs Posted February 27, 2008 Author Report Posted February 27, 2008 nope - got them from another source - mines are 74hc165nwhat really grinds my gears is that i had a batch of old 74ls165n which were 100 % compatible and never had a problem with it - and they are all dead too. how do you test your chips ? with a multimeter ? it's totally impossible that i wrecked 13 chips... Quote
doc Posted February 27, 2008 Report Posted February 27, 2008 Just a quick notice:The ICs are CMOS. Mostly they don't die from the heat but from static electricity caused by potential differences. So, if your iron has a plug for earthing it, please do it. Before you touch the chip make yourself "neutral" by touching an earth point.Difficult to explain in english ... but I hope you understand, what I mean ;DgreetsDoc Quote
bugfight Posted February 27, 2008 Report Posted February 27, 2008 i don't have a meter just a unscaled pot. ...hmmm what model? some of these wind up with ac at the tip.there is also the issue of ESD on some irons... Quote
matrigs Posted February 27, 2008 Author Report Posted February 27, 2008 http://www.techgsm.hu/Soldering_Station_ZD98,3765.htmlit has something like a grounding pin which i'm not sure what to do ? connect to the core while soldering or to something in my room like a radiator?but still - i mean before that i had this totally simple soldering iron just without control of anything and 40watts which is way too much and i didn't use sockets then too and what ? no problems at all. i even sometimes soldered something with the core on and nothing happened - eventually sparks when accidently touching the +5v and ground and reseting the core. back then i was like totally impressed about the durability of the core and all the parts of the ucapps system.but now, as i said - everything goes bogus. ok i have NO IDEA if the 165's are dead - but i mean i have 4 din plates stuffed with 165's from different batches and they all seem totally down... Quote
/tilted/ Posted February 28, 2008 Report Posted February 28, 2008 http://www.techgsm.hu/Soldering_Station_ZD98,3765.htmli have 4 din plates stuffed with 165's from different batches and they all seem totally down...Is it possible you have a core problem?too many hard resets?have you tried changing to your older boards assembled with the old iron? Quote
cimo Posted February 28, 2008 Report Posted February 28, 2008 The ICs are CMOS. Mostly they don't die from the heat but from static electricity caused by potential differences.good point there, i have to admit that since i moved to a new house i had some grounding problems, time to buy a grounding wrist? (or whatever you call it)thing is i have 9 over 12 *165 with failing pins..simone Quote
stryd_one Posted February 28, 2008 Report Posted February 28, 2008 Anti static wrist/ankle straps (grounding straps, whatever) are nice and all for stopping static transfer from you to the device, but they won't help the tip of the iron... Quote
doc Posted February 28, 2008 Report Posted February 28, 2008 Anti static wrist/ankle straps (grounding straps, whatever) are nice and all for stopping static transfer from you to the device, but they won't help the tip of the iron...If the tip of the iron is grounded (like mine ;D), it will help!Good soldering stations have a plug, where you can ground the tip of the iron.greetsDoc Quote
cimo Posted February 28, 2008 Report Posted February 28, 2008 My iron (ERSA) has a german plug but i am not sure if all the different cables going to the main have a ground line, i ll check it out when i ll be back home.(still: how does it come that nobody had these kind of problems before?)Simone Quote
stryd_one Posted February 28, 2008 Report Posted February 28, 2008 I bought the hakko 936 ESD model clone, and wrist and ankle strap, and hoped like heck they work as advertised ;)(BTW, if you're standing/sitting still and soldering for a while, use ankle not wrist straps, it keeps the cable out of the way) Quote
DavidBanner Posted February 28, 2008 Report Posted February 28, 2008 I have one of those Irons - but in a black case, the cardboard box is identical. I have had no problems whatsoever with the iron killing components.I'm in the UK and I know the earth pin is going to ground via the mains....you attach a wrist strap to the back of the base to ground yourself...it has something like a grounding pin which i'm not sure what to do ? connect to the core while soldering or to something in my room like a radiator?that would be about the worst thing you could do. You want to make a path to earth that avoids any ESD. Electricity will take the easiest route to ground, that's why you ground yourself; grounding the core would mean that the electricty heads to ground via the component, tracks of the core leading to ground.... Quote
DavidBanner Posted February 28, 2008 Report Posted February 28, 2008 - DISCLAIMER: Never, ever, ever, ever work on lethal voltages (pay someone else), dB is neither human nor a good role model. -This is also why when working on lethal voltages you never ever ever work with two hands - this would mean potential for voltage to go through one arm - through the heart and out to ground via the other arm - this is how people die.Best practice: Kneel with your RIGHT knee on the ground and use your RIGHT hand - this way any voltage will go through the arm, down the torso and down the right leg to ground, possibly saving your ass. Quote
/tilted/ Posted February 28, 2008 Report Posted February 28, 2008 possibly saving your ass.well... saving your left cheek, anyway. ;) Quote
matrigs Posted February 28, 2008 Author Report Posted February 28, 2008 okay i'm totally down on this thing here... i just finished another din with a fresh batch of 165's, the iron grounded and used sockets this time so the 165's didn't even touch the iron itself. look what i get on the screen when pressing a button:i really don't know what happened here - any hints ? Quote
matrigs Posted February 28, 2008 Author Report Posted February 28, 2008 o how great - now it seems that not my torch but my core is killing everything - a few seconds ago the next optocoupler died - put in a new one, works. how great - i have a killer core Quote
matrigs Posted February 28, 2008 Author Report Posted February 28, 2008 is fine - 4.9 sometiems 4.8. i even switched it on a few times with the multimeter attached to make sure that there is no "peak" going on or something like this. i connected this new din to my old v2 core and it works perfectly fine - so it seems that something with my new core is damn wrong. but there is not much that i can check - voltages are perfectly fine. Quote
stryd_one Posted February 29, 2008 Report Posted February 29, 2008 is fine - 4.9 sometiems 4.8. i even switched it on a few times with the multimeter attached to make sure that there is no "peak" going on or something like this. i connected this new din to my old v2 core and it works perfectly fine - so it seems that something with my new core is damn wrong. but there is not much that i can check - voltages are perfectly fine. What about cabling? You didn't say which cable you moved and which stayed attached to it's core..What app was that above? Have you done this: srio_interconnection_test_v1a.zip ? Quote
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