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8xSID MB-SID PCB (aka. MB-6582) - request for comments

Wilba

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Wilba MIDIbox Guru

Wilba

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Of course they could do that, but that solution doesn't really work with the base PCB and the PT-10 case with the default rearpanel, which has a neat square hole to suit the C64 power switch. The main reason I hunted down those 6582 chips was to satisfy the need for SIDs without destroying C64s.

Just got an email from SmashTV who has located an (almost) identical switch to the C64 power switch, also from Mountain Switches!

http://www.mouser.com/catalog/specsheets/MS-100818.pdf

Thanks Smash! (strike-through edit by SmashTV: I was wrong this switch does not fit...Not even close :-\)

For those who are interested, here's the latest version of the panel artwork:

http://members.optusnet.com.au/~wilba6581/mb-6582/MB-6582_frontpanel.fpd

http://members.optusnet.com.au/~wilba6581/mb-6582/MB-6582_rearpanel.fpd

They're slightly different to the ones on my MB-6582:

* moved button and reduced to two LEDs for matrix mode, i.e. just Mod and Meter.

* labeled buttons around menu encoder, i.e. left, right, up, down, shift, menu

* renamed LFO waveform "Ramp" to "Positive" (to match V2 "positive-only" waveforms!)

* renamed second row of envelope parameters

* removed Curve Assign button/LEDs, now redundant!

* renamed Osc Control label "Assign" to "Knob"

* renamed mod sources "E1", "E2", "L1", "L2", etc. to "1", "2", "3", etc.

* renamed Osc knob label "Arpeggiator" to "Phase Offset" (to match V2 "phase offset" param!)

People who want the control surface PCB can be very confident that the size and hole placements described by this panel are not going to change (except maybe the hole for the display, which I will make slightly bigger to suit the display being further back). So you can start using these FPD files as a basis for your own panel artwork, resize the panel bigger to suit a different box, etc. I will advise people NOT to order panels just yet though... it ain't final until the PCBs are made, OK?  ;D

**edit** I forgot to mention, the holes for the encoders on that panel are bigger than they need to be, to support the illuminated knobs idea, which I turned off anyway  ;)  I will resize them smaller to suit smaller knobs.

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ringmod45 MIDIbox Newbie

ringmod45

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Since you need to know, we are 4 SID freaks who plan to build Wilba's wonderful design. One envelope instead of 4, kinda like Car-Pooling.  ;)

Cheers,

RM

What in the world would you need 4 sets of PCB's for???

I mean that's 32 SIDs, I am a SID freak but 32 is overkill.

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Wilba MIDIbox Guru

Wilba

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Updates:

Some minor tweaks of the frontpanel labelling.

http://members.optusnet.com.au/~wilba6581/mb-6582/MB-6582_frontpanel.fpd

Changed matrix/meter mode button/LEDs.

Curve Assign button/LEDs remain on PCB, if I find a use for them I will add holes/labels back to the panel  ;)

http://members.optusnet.com.au/~wilba6581/mb-6582/MB-6582_CS_PCB.pdf

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Wilba MIDIbox Guru

Wilba

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THE TIME HAS COME

Finally, the moment you've all been waiting for, a production of the PCBs will be made very, very soon.

I added up the requests and we're at 49 for the base PCB and 25 for the control surface PCB, that's an unconfirmed number, and may include people "interested" but not going to actually "order". Still, I'm pretty amazed by that number.

http://www.midibox.org/dokuwiki/doku.php?id=wilba_mb_6582_orders

I've tried to send a PM to everyone but since I can only do 20 an hour, it will take a couple more hours to PM everyone... some of you may miss the PM, so I'll quote it here also:

You are receiving this message because you want to order one or more PCBs that I used in my MB-6582 synth. Before I order PCBs to be made, I want you to confirm you still want one or more PCBs. Also, some people want the control surface PCB but have not confirmed they want to join in the bulk order of the frontpanel and rearpanel, made by Front Panel Express or Schaeffer. If you plan to use the control surface PCB, then it's your choice whether to join in this bulk order or not, but it will be a lot cheaper if you do. The only reason I can think that you would NOT want to join in the bulk order is if you are NOT going to use the PacTec PT-10 case, OR you really don't like white on black. Even if you plan to do your own fancy artwork with Lazertran or something, it's probably cheaper (and better) to use the black anodized panel from the bulk order than ordering an unanodized one with no artwork. (Also, I don't know how good JB Weld sticks to unanodized aluminium!)

If you want the base PCB, please confirm you want the base PCB.

If you want the control surface PCB, please confirm whether you ALSO want to join in the bulk order of panels.

View the current order list here:

http://www.midibox.org/dokuwiki/doku.php?id=wilba_mb_6582_orders

and for MY convenience, please email me at Jason.S.Williams@@@gmail.com, with your MIDIbox/uCapps forum user name in the subject, e.g. "MB-6582 ORDER CONFIRMATION FROM Wilba". The email address you use will be added to a mailing list, and ideally should also be the email address you will use for PayPal payment, and one you check regularly.

You may continue to post questions about the PCBs, construction details, parts, etc. on the forum:

http://www.midibox.org/forum/index.php?topic=9238.0

Best Regards,

Wilba

P.S. Since people usually don't follow instructions or pay close attention, go back and read this message again  ;)

If I've missed you, you've changed your mind, or you've been lurking and not committing to an order yet, then now is the time to speak up. Also, people ordering a control surface PCB are strongly advised to join the bulk order of the panels, as this is going to be a lot cheaper and a greater chance of success.

For example:

Frontpanel cost is 1x @ $118.62 and 20x @ $83.03

Rearpanel cost is 1x @ $33.07 and 20x @ $23.15

(US Dollars)

So that's a saving of $45 if you join in the bulk order. Hopefully the number will get up to the 20x price break, there are 25 of you wanting the control surface PCB so it's entirely possible. I'm just not sure who'll want to arrange the $3000 order!  ;D  It will probably end up being me, as I've dealt with Front Panel Express before and could probably haggle with them a little, extra 10% off or something, and can combine shipping of PCBs and panels...  ;)

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sonicwarrior MIDIbox Tweaker

sonicwarrior

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It will probably end up being me, as I've dealt with Front Panel Express before and could probably haggle with them a little, extra 10% off or something, and can combine shipping of PCBs and panels...  ;)

When the panel order exceeds 20 it would make sense to order the panels with silkscreen.

E.g. WK-Mechanik in Germany takes .fpd files and makes silkcreened panels from them.

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Wilba MIDIbox Guru

Wilba

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The panel order has reached 23, with a possible 13 more.

Wow!  :o

sonicwarrior: Can you arrange a quote from WK-Mechanik? Make sure they can do white silkscreen on 1.5mm thick black anodized aluminium. I would do it myself but it's all German  ???

I said from the beginning I am not selling kits but I have decied that I will arrange the bulk orders of control surface components and maybe the switch/power socket (because they're pretty specific and hard to find).

I am a bit worried about you all requesting quotes for 15 knobs from http://www.albs.de and poor Balthasar having a heart attack, or worse, taking even longer that is typical of him to process your order, or even worse, being told 15 knobs is too small an order for him to bother with. So please don't order knobs for yourself just yet, this will only make things difficult when someone does a bulk order.

I'm assuming the majority of you wanting the CS PCB and panels also want knobs like mine, the only ones available now come in black with red strips, but maybe not enough for everyone, there's a few more with transparent red strips, which should look equally cool. This probably means people will be happy with red LEDs and a green backlit 4x20 LCD, a very nice combo which I've seen done before, and posted pics on this thread before.

In order to keep the noise on this thread down  ;)  I'll send out emails about joining bulk orders of components, particularly the knobs, but I might as well arrange orders for PT-10 case, LCD, rotary encoders, switches, LEDs, 10mm threaded spacers, power switch and power socket, as these are the parts specific to the control surface. i.e. It makes sense to buy a new power switch and power socket than destroy a perfectly good C64 for these parts, and I'm willing to arrange the bulk orders to save that poor little C64  ;) Similarly, you can get good deals on the more expensive items.

If people are happy to pay in advance for the parts they are ordering, then I'll have the money required to make bulk orders and pay for them, then after all the bits are assembled, I can send requests for postage costs. In theory, the postage costs of a big parcel of bits from me should be less than the sum of postage costs of individual parts, plus any savings you get from joining in the bulk order should make this a worthwhile exercise.

However, I won't bother with the other common electronic components, as most of you are in Europe and get far better deals than I can from online electronics shops.

Feel free to comment on this idea, but don't just post "Yes I will join the bulk orders", wait for the email I will send you soon and reply to that please.

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Wilba MIDIbox Guru

Wilba

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Quick estimate of the cost (US$) of control surface components, if purchased through a bulk order of 40 "boxes".


Product			Qty per Box	Total per Box
PacTec PT-10		1		$18.28
ALPS SKHHDTA010		47		$11.75
Rotary Encoder		15		$24.30
Knobs			15		$18.39
10mm Threaded Spacers	22		$7.26
LEDs			109		$10.90
20x4 LCD, YG backlight	1		$20.30
TOTAL					$111.18
[/code]
That price might even come down a little if I get the encoders direct from China ;) but maybe for the convenience of ordering a lot of these parts from Mouser and combining shipping, it's not worth the effort. LEDs will probably come from an eBay dealer. Knobs are tricky though, there's not enough knobs at ALBS to cover 40 boxes, so maybe I can get a new production of the black with white or clear strips... an order for 600 might be enough, I don't know yet... but I'll probably pick something neutral so people can choose different LEDs and LCD if they really must  ;)
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Twin-X MIDIbox Guru

Twin-X

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sonicwarrior: Can you arrange a quote from WK-Mechanik? Make sure they can do white silkscreen on 1.5mm thick black anodized aluminium. I would do it myself but it's all German  ???

I asked a quote from Purusha from the groupdiy forums. I have some great screened panels from him.

Hope you don't mind.

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Wilba MIDIbox Guru

Wilba

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Update: PCBs are going to be US$20 each. This includes shipping to me, and any other extra costs.

Twin-x: I'm OK with you (or anyone) finding a good deal on the panels. It's going to be at least 25 panels, maybe up to 40 by the time we order.

I might need the help of a U.S. MIDIboxer to receive a bulk order of the power sockets, I found a dealer with a good price but they don't ship international.  >:(  These may or may not have the right pinouts as the C64 ones, so I may need to tweak the layout, hopefully not.

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Wilba MIDIbox Guru

Wilba

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There are still people who have not confirmed their order for PCBs and whether they want to join in the bulk order of panels. This thing is going to drag out for ages if people aren't checking their PMs and emails regularly.

The plan at this stage is to get just the PCB order done, that means collecting PayPal payments for just the PCBs + shipping, which I can then use to pay for the PCB manufacturing (they conveniently take PayPal payments, so this works out well for me!) That means people will get their PCBs sooner, and can start soldering the base PCB while they wait on bulk orders of panels and other components. I don't see much point in holding up the PCB order while all the other orders are being put together, especially the knobs.

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sonicwarrior MIDIbox Tweaker

sonicwarrior

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sonicwarrior: Can you arrange a quote from WK-Mechanik? Make sure they can do white silkscreen on 1.5mm thick black anodized aluminium. I would do it myself but it's all German  ???

Yes, but I need the .fpd file for that.

I asked a quote from Purusha from the groupdiy forums. I have some great screened panels from him.

He needs a Corel Draw file as input. Errors may evolve if he draws everything new. :-\

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amp1ron MIDIbox Newbie

amp1ron

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If you want the base PCB, please confirm you want the base PCB.

If you want the control surface PCB, please confirm whether you ALSO want to join in the bulk order of panels.

View the current order list here:

http://www.midibox.org/dokuwiki/doku.php?id=wilba_mb_6582_orders

I sent my confirmation for all three pieces a few days ago.  I want to make sure I don't miss out.  How do I check to see if I'm on the list for one each of the base PCB, CS PCB, and panel bulk order?

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acidman MIDIbox Newbie

acidman

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@ Wilba

it would be very very nice to maby get a full pack (all components, all pcb, case ect)

a full kit including all nessesary components to built one unit.

is this possible ? if yes, please provide me some pricing info incl. shipping cost to austria (vienna)

im very,very interested in this stuff !!! (and i think many many people would like buy the full kit, and also it would be much easier for you > price calculation ect.)

;D ;D ;D

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stryd_one MIDIbox Guru

stryd_one

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OK someone has to say it, it might as well be me.

Please read the entire thread before you post! :)

Yes, I know there are like 1000000000000 posts, and it will suck to read them all. But it's only gonna get worse if we post without reading, because the same question gets asked, and the same answer posted, more than once. Plus, it's very educational ;)

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