Hawkeye

Hi and welcome! Your design looks nice and may be the thing of choice to build, if you have severe space restrictions. But.. if you have room, I would recommend to go for separate units (bought or self-built), as this simplifies things enormously... Pursuing a modular MIDI concept allows for nice separation of responsibilities and more easy extendability... you can buy or build launchpad-style midi controllers, build a well-designed and very stylish looking wilba-style mbseq v4 (with cv-out) and extend this with a bought good midi master keyboard with weighted and proper-size keys... Bye, Peter

Step 21: Connecting Tactile Switches and LEDs Parts used: * A roll of enamelled copper wire (0.35mm diameter - Reichelt CUL 100/0,35) * Enamelled copper wire insulation removal pliers (Reichelt KN 15 11 120) * Flat nose pliers * Your favourite soldering equipment Description: * This step is really fun, but it is quite time-intensive. We strive to avoid cable spaghetti in the case and use enamelled copper wire (contains an insulation layer of transparent laquer) threaded between upper and lower layer of the vector board to wire control surface components. * Choose the best way of routing the cables for yourself, avoid getting too close to the hex standoffs and stay clear of the cutout zones for the VFD components. * When routing cables, you can use flat nose pliers to tighten the cables everytime you change from the vector board top to the bottom and vice versa. Use special enamelled copper wire insulation removal pliers to remove the laquer layer before soldering. * Connect the tactile switches to the eight data lines of "i3". Photos 1 and 2 show the common ground cabling of the tactile switches. Photos 3 and 4 show how the two switches on the right of the control surface board are connected to i3. * The nice thing is, that you can test connections instantly. Consult the DIN wiring diagram to see which DIN wire is connected to which function by default (we will adjust the mapping later on). Photo 5 was taken after a button, that was still mapped to "play" was pressed. The update speed of the VFD is absolutely stunning. * When you have tested all eight buttons, wire the LEDs. First create a common ground interconnection link wired to every middle pin (photo 6). Then wire the data pins of "o2" to the right pins of the LEDs (viewed from the top), connecting a pair of LEDs with every data pin. You can test the functionality for every LED pair soldered by connecting an "out" cable from the sequencer core (photo 7). After that, connect the data pins of "o1" to pairs of the corresponding left pins of the LEDs (viewed from the top). Note: * When looking at the DOUT wiring diagram, we see that the LEDs 1...8 are inversely wired to data pins 8...1 of the shift registers. To fix that problem, we can either rewire the control surface boards (not nice) or change the data wire order in the o1...o4 crimp connectors, which is very easy to do. For your LED testing convenience, I have added a MBSEQ_HW.V4 (remove the .txt extension), which is tailored to the two central control surface boards (no other buttons configured!), so that you can test the step LEDs by pushing the corresponding step buttons. MBSEQ_HW.V4.txt

Hi, just use the most recent version that you can find here: http://www.ucapps.de...s_download.html Upload setup_sammich_sid.hex and you are ready to take your SIDs for a spin ;-).

@Futureman: :-) Thanks, there are 240 + 18 wires (with VFD control lines), we have to keep the prices for copper up somehow :-) Step 20: Populating the Central CS Boards with LEDs and Rotary Encoders Parts used: * Central CS Boards and epoxy vector board cut-off pieces from step 19 * 16pcs ALPS STEC12E rotary encoders (with push button) (Reichelt STEC12E08) * 16pcs 10mm diameter rotary encoder knobs (Reichelt KNOPF 10-150E) * 32pcs Kingbright Duo LEDs 2x5mm Area LED (Reichelt LED 2 RG-3) * 14pcs M3 10mm standoff (distance spacer to the aluminum frontpanel) * 14pcs M3 8mm screw (temporary for installation) * A dremel tool with cutting wheel * Flat nose pliers * A few centimeters of tape (e.g. tesa tape) Description: * Bend the LED legs with flat nose pliers as shown in photo 1. The longest leg is in the middle, the second-longest leg is on the left, the shortest leg is on the right side. * Insert the LEDs as shown in photo 2. Use tape to temporarily attach the LEDs to the button caps before soldering (photo 3). * Photo 4 shows the desired installation depth of the LEDs, they should be a aligned to the top horizontal edge of the button caps (the caps are slightly taller than that, as the concave mould for the finger is added on top). The tactile switches only have a short push travel length, so the LEDs won´t get in the way when you push the buttons. I was concerned about this installation method at first, but now I am glad, that this way was chosen - the LEDs increase the surface area of the button caps slightly, which improves the tactile feeling. * When you have installed 8x2 step LEDs, the result should look like photo 5. Take your time aligning the LEDs, it is worth it. * Now prepare the standoff vector board stripe cut-off piece from the last step and use it to raise the encoder level by around 1.7mm. Look at photo 6 to see how long the upper vector board stripe should be cut with the dremel tool. * Mark more drill holes as shown in photo 7. Drill the lower vector board with a 2mm and a 3mm drill and the upper vector board stripe with a 6mm drill to allow for equally levelled hex-spacer installation. Install 10mm hex spacers with temporary 8mm screws from the back (photo 8). * Now add the rotary encoders as shown in photo 9. Take your time aligning the the rotary encoders properly (photo 10). You can remove the side stabilization metal hinges (no further drilling necessary) and solder the five pins also to the top of the vector board stripe. The two-sided soldering from the top and the bottom increases stability to a very good level. * Repeat this step and populate the other central board as well.

nILS is right, the MB6582 has quite some solder connections... the SammichSID comes to mind if you want an easy, well documented project suitable for two SIDs, which is available as a completely packaged kit. And... it is sold by a hero ;-)

Step 19: Creating and connecting the Central CS Boards Parts used: * 2 pcs stable (epoxy) vector board 16cm x 10cm with soldering pads on both sides (Reichelt) * The VFD display modules (for space measurements) * 12pcs 10-pin angled board connector sockets (Reichelt PSS 254/10W) * 12pcs 10-pin empty board connector crimp plugs (Reichelt PSK 254/10W) * 120pcs board connector crimp contacts - buy in larger quantities for rebates (Reichelt PSK-KONTAKTE contains 20 per pack) * 16pcs tactile switch E-Switch TL1100F160Q (Digi-Key EG1821-ND) - buy 64 for the SEQ and add 300 for the BLM(!) * 16pcs button cap PE BK (Digi-Key 401-1152-ND) - buy 64 for the SEQ and add 300 for the BLM(!) * A label maker (optional) * Dremel tool with cutting wheel * A bench drill or a hand drill with 2mm and 3mm drills Description: * Cut the vector boards to a height of 82mm. 32 inner vertical grid points must be fully available. Save the cut-off pieces of the boards. We will use them to lift the step encoders a little bit later on. * Place a character display module (VFD) on the vector boards and mark cutout zones for all components that are higher than 2 millimeters. Leave 5 grids upper space for the connectors to the sequencer core. Cut out the marked areas with a dremel and compare with photo 1. * Solder six 10-pin angled board connector sockets to the underside of the vector board as shown in photo 2. Label the inputs on the top side of the vector board as shown in photo 3 (D1: display one, I1-I3, O1-O2: connect to the corresponding cables from step 17). * Repeat the above steps and prepare the second vector board (photo 4). * Insert the tactile switches as shown in photo 5. Make sure, that they are pressed firmly onto the boards, then solder them on both boards. * Drill the boards as marked in photo 6 with a 2mm drill first and then with a 3mm drill. The epoxy-based boards are quite sturdy, but we will add more holes for standoffs for maximum stability later on. The VFD demonstrates that each tactile switch is below its five character cells. * Bundle I1 to I6 and O1 to O4, so that they are in the order of the DIN/DOUT PCB solder points (photo 7). Now lead them through the middle of the floppy door (photo 8). * Cut these cables (measuring from the floppy door), so that the CS connectors are 50cm away from the sequencer core (the V-Synth is 40 cm wide). The outer cables need to be slightly longer than the inner ones. * Crimp them with your crimping tool (if you don´t have one, don´t hesitate to buy one, it is essential!) in the correct color order, put on the board connector plugs and label them on the plug (photo 9). You can also rebundle the cables with cable binders, now. * Continue with the connectors until I1 to I6 and O1 to O4 are connected. In the next steps we will wire the components, add LEDs and rotary encoders and test the connections. Note: * Depending on your board connector plugs and due to the connector density, you may have to sand off the edges of the board connector plugs a little bit. I had to take off 0.2mm of plastic using fine sanding paper.

Step 18: Building a temporary Construction Base for the Control Surface Parts used: * 3pcs vector boards 50cm x 10cm (Reichelt) * 4pcs vector boards 15cm x 10cm (Reichelt) * 8mm M3 screws (buy a larger quantity in any mechanical store) * M3 nuts (buy a larger quantity in any mechanical store) * Bench drill or hand drill with a 2mm and 3mm drill Foreword: * The temporary base serves as a construction grid with a 2.54mm pitch. * It will be substituted by a CNCed aluminum base with drilled holes for the control surface connection screws later on. * The control surface design is intentionally very slim (only 75mm deep) and very wide (1000mm wide) to fit perfectly below an old Roland V-Synth V1 synthesizer in a keyboard stand without adding too much "depth" to the keyboard. Also, it will be very flat (around 20mm), which is why we put most components in the 1541 floppy disk case. When finished, it will be comparable to an oversized PC keyboard. * The V-Synth has an angled vertical lower edge, which we will use to lead out the interconnection cables to the sequencer core (the upper side wall of the control surface case will therefore not be vertical). Description: * Look at photo 1 to see the planned underside of the construction base. Use two layers of vector boards to provide more stability and to emulate the 3mm thick aluminum floor, which we will use later on. Interleave vector boards to achieve better stability and cut the too long boards at the end to finally create a 1000mm x 100mm dual-layer vectorboard base. * Drill holes periodically at the lower edge of the construction base (we will only use the upper 70 millimeters for control surface construction). I used a spacing of ~50mm (20 grid units) in two rows. Fasten the boards from below with 8mm M3 screws fastened by M3 nuts. Photos 2 and 3 show the completed construction base. * Let´s lay out a virtual coordinate system for drilling and control surface module placement. Mark the vertical central line (photo 4). Let´s say that any grid hole on this line is at x-coordinate 0. Mark a lower line for the bottom part of the control surface (photo 5). Let´s say, that any grid hole on this line is at y-coordinate 0. * We are now set for control surface module construction. The sequencer core provides us with 24 in/out cable bundles, which we will connect to every control surface module, just as needed. * The nice thing is, that we can organize "sections" of the control surface on separate vector boards and keep the individual modules manageable.

Also, consider building a MB6582 - it is a great package with the awesome power of up to 8xSID, it is not difficult to build and can be done in two weeks, if you have time in the evenings... there are also building tutorials with parts lists floating around ;-)

Step 17: Creating a proper DIN/DOUT Sandwich (a proper sandwich contains a "n" and a "d" :-)) Parts used: * all assembled DIN/DOUT modules from step 16 * a few centimeters of cable * electrical isolation tape * M3 nylon washers (buy a larger quantity in any electronics store) * M3 nuts (buy a larger quantity in any electronics store) * 8mm M3 hex standoffs (buy a larger quantity in any electronics store) * 5mm M3 hex standoffs (buy a larger quantity in any electronics store) * 12mm M3 screws (buy a larger quantity in any electronics store) * 8mm M3 screws (buy a larger quantity in any electronics store) Update (2010/12/28): * [iMPORTANT] Instead of soldering 5-pin bridges between the boards, just use angled DIL headers and 10-pin IDC connectors with short straight cables, as depicted in photo 12. This saves time and ensures the proper connection of serial inputs/outputs. Description: * First of all, mark each ribbon wire bundle with I1 to I12 or O1 to O12 respectively, so that you can reidentify them later on (photo 1). I1 to I4 are provided by the first DIN module, I5 to I8 by the second, and so on.. * Use isolation tape to mask the ribbon wire solder pads (photo 2) * Using short strands of cable, solder the three DIN modules together to a DIN chain and solder the three DOUT modules together to a DOUT chain (photos 3 and 4). Photo 5 shows the completed DIN chain ready for case installation. * Using four 12mm M3 screws from the case underside, four plastic washers on the case bottom, then the PCB fastened by two M3 nuts on M3 washers and two 8mm hex standoffs, install the first DIN module (containing the connection header to the Core32) as shown in photo 6. * Prepare the second DIN module by adding two 8mm hex standoffs to its bottom, fastened with 8mm M3 screws. Add two 5mm hex standoffs to its top, fastened by 12mm M3 screws to its top (photo 7). * Fasten the second DIN module as shown in photo 8. * Prepare the third DIN module by adding two 5mm and 8mm hex standoffs to its top, fastened with 8mm M3 screws (photo 9) * Install the third DIN module by adding two M3 washers and M3 nuts (photo 10). * Continue with this installation scheme by adding the first DOUT module on top of the last DIN module and proceeding as before. Photo 11 shows the result. A proper sandwich ;-) Notes: * If all screws are fastened properly, this installation method provides very good stability. It might be easier though, to use longer M3 screws or a M3 thread bar. * The DIN/DOUT chain terminators are not depicted here. See last step for more information.

Ouch! Hope your hand is getting better... It really seems that your designed Mixer PCBs are very nice ... It should not be too much hassle to integrate them with the Core32 and then it should be quite easy to create a decoupled user interface... Or just create a Core8/Core32 Control Surface and control everything via MIDI... I also like the idea of separating the mixing desk controls from the big cable mess :-). Your project has provided a wealth of information, big thanks! Will have to finish that MBSeq first before further planning :-) Bye! Peter

Hey, that sounds very nice, all in all... thank you for your long description of the audio quality - that is good enough for me... :-) btw. with cascading (sorry for the unclear description, it is not my native tongue ;-)) I meant the audio signal going through multiple chained 4311s, which I think would worsen the sound quality (as it goes through multiple amp stages) - but this is not the case in your design and this is very good :) When my other project is finished and my government grants me another time segment ;-), there are two ways to continue... a) use your mixer pcbs and extend the design with motorfaders for volume control and encoders for panning and fx sends ... if possible, I don´t want to dive into core8 programming.. maybe there is a way to connect everything to a core32... b) use an own approach with the 4311s... I just had the following idea allowing for an arbitrary number of mixing channels only involving one 4311 per mono input channel, I would love to hear your comments on that :) audio in socket | direct out socket | |_ input led level meters (higher than 10 led per channel resolution can be obtained by cascading the lm3915s) | |_ 4311 (same audio signal connected to audio in ports 1...4) |_ mix audio out 1: fx 1 send |_ mix audio out 2: fx 2 send |_ mix audio out 3: fx 3 send |_ mix audio out 4: master bus send and then on each mono master bus, use a plain and simple passive audio summer (resistors) configured for the correct number of channels (e.g. 8 mono channels) Edit: as far as I understood now, you do exactly the same... the passive summers are not necessary, if the master bus send signal from above is attenuated enough to allow for simple connection linking. right? if so, that is great, but one might nevertheless use a passive summer to increase resolution, as the attenuation would have to be done using only 8-bit volume controls on every channel... to keep the cost of the control surface down, per stereo channel, one could use (from top to bottom): an endless encoder for input gain an endless encoder for stereo panning three endless encoders for fx1-3 sends (all endless encoders optional with led rings from a led matrix) one motorfader for volume control, buttons for solo and mute. What do you think? If I by mistake reused any of your ideas, please accept my apologies... Thanks and bye, Peter

@Lylehaze: thanks for the quick feedback! I am still building another project and would rather not mix things up (literally ;-)), so there is no need for haste ;-) How would you classify the audio quality of the 4311? Good enough, even when they are cascaded? Do you have any thoughts regarding the internal audio amp? I ask this, because commercial mixer vendors highly stress their amplification stages (and come out with new names for them every other year ;-).... Sorry, questions over questions ;-) I´ve had a quick peek into the tech specs... the serial mixer communication reminds me of my latest adventures with VFDs :-)... but yes, this will work ;-) sorry can´t say more at the moment, gotta dig deeper into the matter first ;-). Also, I fear, that I do not have enough hardware experience to pull this off :-(. @jrock: thanks a lot... did not look into it in detail yet....... are the tl084 audio amplifiers good enough? Lylehaze´s approach using dedicated mixer chips controlled by the core is very neat and seems superior in terms of price, speed and resolution to motorized potentiometers for mixing... on the other hand... the circuitry is completely passive if we ignore the tl084s... if we use some very high quality amps... i could imagine the sound quality being superior to a cascade of 4311s... i just don´t know and have no means and experience to measure or judge it :-( --- Btw: i found this chip to realize the led audio level bars: http://www.national..../LM/LM3915.html Have a nice weekend! Peter

Step 16: Preparing the DIN/DOUT Module Cable Connections to Core32 and Control Surface Parts Used: * Some meters of coloured 10-pin ribbon cable (connection to the breakout-box control surface) (AVI Showtech) * 3pcs 10-pin IDC connectors (AVI Showtech) * The 1541 drive front panel from step 1 * Some time and your favourite soldering equipment Description: * Create an Y-Cable with three IDC connectors, to connect the DIN and DOUT modules to J8/J9 of the Core32. Splice the wires and use your fingernails or a screwdriver to push the wires into the opened IDC metal crimp connectors as shown in photo 1. Photo 2 shows the assembled cable. * Use your multimeter to measure the correct pinout of your cable reviewing the Core32 J8/J9 diagram and the DIN/DOUT module diagrams. Make sure, that J8 (upper row of the IDC connector on the Core32) goes into the first DOUT module, whereas J9 (lower row) goes into the first DIN module. Mark the plugs to avoid later confusion (photo 3). * Solder 10-pin ribbon wires to the output pins as shown in photo 4. The cables should be as short as possible, but as long as necessary to connect your external control surface board. Photo 5 shows a DIN module with spliced and bundled ribbon wires to the control surface. If possible, use colored ribbon wires and use the same color order everywhere (e.g. black for pin 1, white for pin 2, etc..). When you have soldered 6x4x10 wires, let´s call it a day :-) * If you experience any problems with your buttons/encoders/LEDs later on, make sure to put arnolds (terminators ;-)) on the end of both DIN/DOUT chains as depicted here. * When you install the DIN/DOUT sandwich in the next step, the wires to the control surface should be led out of the floppy door. You can reuse the floppy front panel LEDs for status indication (photo 6) - let´s connect the green (ex 1541 POWER) LED to the aout_ng (we did not build it yet ;-)) status led and the yellow (ex 1541 DRIVE) LED to the Core32 power LED (which will blink in sync, when a pattern is played).

Looking at TKs pings (especially comparing ping 1 and ping 2), I don´t think, the router adds 100ms periodically. Its more likely an unresponsive iPad TCP network stack (due to some app or the IOS periodically taking all processing power and not context switching very quickly).It would be interesting to see pings without the Juce app running...

Sorry für den Doppelpost... wollte Dich nur noch auf eine Sache hinweisen... nimm ein besseres LCD als die 10-Dollar Billigklasse, also eines, was nicht so lange "nachleuchtet"... Muss jetzt meines auch upgraden, hab hier zum Vergleich ein VFD für den MBSEQ vorliegen und merke erst jetzt, wie bescheiden das LCD in meinem MB6582 ist... Ciao, Peter

omg, ich sollt halt vorm Posten Lesen X-) - auf jeden Fall viel Spaß beim Bauen, ist ein sehr schönes Projekt! Achja und den Zoll würd ich mittlerweile auch umgehen, wo auch immer möglich... ich hasse die Burschen ;-)

I did not do much market research, but i´d be willing to sacrifice a small toe for a thing like this, if the audio quality is decent. Best of all: no frills/gimmicks... and shelling out 1.5k bucks for a digital mixer made in china isnt cheap either... Edit: Lyle´s project page contains a wealth of information... thanks, ilmenator!

Can we build a MIDIBox audio mixer? I mean MIDI-controlled and digital for motorfaders and total recall, bundled with a purely analogue mixing engine? inputs: 8x stereo in (also connect fx send returns here) usb (core32) midi in (core32) power (motorfaders) outputs: 8x direct stereo out (for directly recording the inputs) 2x stereo fx send out 1x stereo mix out midi out (core32) control surface: one motor fader per channel two motorized potentiometer fx send channels per channel two motorized potentiometers for analogue stereo mixing (used internally only) per channel no hi/med/low equalizer/sound adjustment stage for pure sound per channel sound input level meters per channel ("stereo" level meter LEDs) sound output level meters for mix out ("stereo" level meter LEDs) mute button + LED per channel (-> alters motorized mixing potentiometers of this channel) solo button + LED per channel (-> alters motorized mixing potentiometers of the other channels) small character lcd or vfd for mixing info I´d be willing to code the app, but have no plan in hardware design ;-). Any thoughts? Bye, Peter

Mhm, i keep asking myself... not having resolved my mixer issue and using software digital mixing and 4x2 channels of my m-audio usb interface... Can we build a MIDIBox audio mixer? I mean MIDI-controlled and digital for motorfaders and total recall, bundled with a purely analogue mixing engine? Edit: I haz made new topic for this: Bye, Peter

Mhm, it seems customs has intercepted my low value parcel... I hate them guys... (Smash: is there a way to track it? I guess not for these low shipping rates...) Edit: forget it ;-) It arrived today. :frantics: