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Control surface PCB for 16 encoders/LEDrings Bulk Order


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I got the "Low-Cost LEDs" from Reichelt today, and the outcome was very good!

lre8x2.jpg

The brightness is perfect, especially against spotlight! :smile:

So: LED 3MM RT is the recommended LED
For the US guys: can you recommend a similar part from Mouser? The mcd value should be at least 10 (than higher, than better)


Here a direct comparison new vs. old LEDs:
lre8x2_comparison.jpg


Best Regards, Thorsten.

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Dear members, First, I excuse myself to all that I didn't answer individually more early but my life didn't let me lot of time to do so before.   I come back to you to indicate I've finished the de

One thing I would point out is to be careful with shipping.  I think everything came in my order however it was close to not being that way.  The top of the package was ripped open from the boards and

Hi. I inform members of the start of a bulk order concerning a all-in-one PCB integrating DINx4/Doutx4 modules and a control surface with 16 encoders/16 LEDrings. The list ends the November 23t

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With ULNs installed.

I haven't tested it without (because I've no bridges ready), but I checked if it makes a difference if the resistors are replaced.

Outcome: 220 Ohm resistors are a good value, 47 Ohm resistors don't make a big visual difference, but increase the power consumption.

 

Best Regards, Thorsten.

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i have a short question to the encoders that are used....

what is better the version with detends or without detends? what feels and works better? without detends i think it feels mor like a "poti" but is it usefull on those devices like this encoder matrix or other projects like MB6582?

 

Regards

MaG2k

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That is totally up to you and only a question of personal taste. I for one like the detents - the input is digital (and thus quantized) anyways, so why pretend to be operating an analog device? Also, I don't believe that removing the detent of a new encoder adds to its expected lifetime...

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you dont realy have to remove them...you have the choice at buying them...ther are 3 Versions available...one without detends, one with 12 detends and one with 24 detends per revolution. so thatswhy my question was only about the feeling. i have to decide which one i buy next time and i'm arguabel which one is better...

 

Regards

MaG2k

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i think one wouldnt be enough for the projects i have open...but i think to order 100 pieces of each. so my question was only to safe money because i imagined that anybody here means this one or that one would be better. so i could save to buy both. But thanx for your help...i think i have to try it out.

What i realized on the detend version i have in the SEQV4 is that eachone of the 16 encoders has an other haptic feeling. they are all different. some are click very hard and are easy to turn, some are realy soft and are harder to turn. i think i better buy many and select them which should come together on one device.

 

Regards

MaG2k

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What i realized on the detend version i have in the SEQV4 is that eachone of the 16 encoders has an other haptic feeling. they are all different. some are click very hard and are easy to turn, some are realy soft and are harder to turn.

 

That is rather unusual and may be a sign of a low quality product.

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i don't know were SmashTV ordered them and i will check that one i will order at Mouser...manufacturer of thatone i will order is bourns!

They are/were Bourns brand, from Mouser.

 

I will check the ones I have in stock for similar variance.  I am skeptical of the quality after hearing this (and if they are not 100% I will be removing them from the shop). 

 

Tension variance and jumpy behavior can be caused by overheating during soldering, but I am much more likely to blame poor QC at Bourns than assembly issues.

 

Best regards

 

Tim

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Hi SmashTV,

 

it was not my intent to say that they are bad but i relized that every of the 17 encoder has an other behavior...the most are nearly equal with only minimal differences but some are realy differnt from the others...they are turning like they have grease inside the encoder. the time i needed for soldering was on every encoder equaly. I think because of my work i do have nearly professional solder skills but it could also be possible that some tolerances in the encoder or solderingtime evoke this behavior. But as i said some posts before i will buy a lot of encoders at mouser next months so that i will be shure that i buy good one.

 

Regards

MaG2k

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Guys,

 

With regard to the MBSeqv4 encoders.  I also experienced the different "feel" for each of the 16 encoders.  Some were hard, some were soft and the detent "click" seemed to vary in how solid/loose it feels.

 

I found that their stiffness was a factor of how far down the knob on the encoder is pushed.  I think if you set them down too far you can get varying levels of friction between the knob and control surface causing them to feel stiffer than they are (specially if the knob isn't perfectly round and/or parallel to the control surface).  Once I played with mine and moved the stiff ones up a fraction from the control surface they all became much more consistent, easy to turn, with mostly the same feel.

 

Might be worth seeing if those results can be replicated.  I always lubricate the insides of the knobs before putting them on the encoders so they aren't too hard to readjust (or get off if you need too), as some fit way too snug.

 

Since doing this the knobs have been much more comfortable to use and differences is quality aren't as obvious.

 

Cheers,

 

Arkay.

 

P.S.  This could also be relevant.  I bought my MB6582 encoders from mouser, all bourns type, and had no end of trouble with the entire batch.  Don't know why but they would skip endlessly, some worse than others, and I ended up having to desolder the lot and replace them.

 

I then purchased the ones Hawkeye recommended in his build thread (I think they were ALPS encoders).  There was a very clear and obvious difference in the quality of the 2 with the ALPS feeling much more solid and consistent.  Having only used those 2 differing types I can say that I'd be wary of the bourns, particularly if removing the detents.

 

That being said I didn't have any similar issues with the ones Tim supplies with the MBSeq kit, and I'm sure they are the same.  But the detents are not removed in the MBSeqv4 build so perhaps as long as you don't open them you're in good shape.

 

I've since decided that I prefer the detent anyway, even in the MB6582, as ilmenator suggest above, the input is digital and quantized. For me the detents add more clearly defined graduations for whatever element you're adjusting.  It also makes troubleshooting encoder types much easier if the encoder still has the detent installed.  When you can't feel the click it's very hard to see/feel when the bit pattern is changing when setting the encoder type in code (if you ever need to).

Edited by Arkay
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I got the "Low-Cost LEDs" from Reichelt today, and the outcome was very good!

So: LED 3MM RT is the recommended LED

For the US guys: can you recommend a similar part from Mouser? The mcd value should be at least 2,5 (than higher, than better)

 

We shared with Tk and we found useful to create in the Wikipage a list of LEDs with are successfully or unsuccessfully tested.

Members are very welcome to edit this page to complete the black list.

Regards,

Jerome.

Edited by Fairlightiii
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Hi T.K. and Fairlightiii,

 

as i red your post about the brightness of the 5x2 LEDs i smashed my hands together over my head...because i would like to order 5x2 LEDs at mouser. but i looked in your good and bad LED list and saw that the one you used from mouser are different. the one i found is thisone:

 

http://de.mouser.com/ProductDetail/Lite-On/LTL-433HR/?qs=sGAEpiMZZMs4quMj8r4lmtqjHxr0ZwUoLwbrnVHqAN4%3d

 

they do have 3,7mcd and are hence brighter than the round one from Reichelt (they have 2,5mcd).

what do you think about these one?

i didnt ordered them right now...but in february i will place an order so it would be nice to here of you if it could be i positiv candidat!

 

Regards

MaG2k

 

P.S.: what do you think about this round LEDs 3mm from Mouser:

 

http://de.mouser.com/ProductDetail/Kingbright/WP132XID/?qs=sGAEpiMZZMs4quMj8r4lmsNxrQ0ZQMdoZ%2fc%2fv7yOhNA%3d

 

they have 25mcd....will they be to bright???

Edited by MaG2k
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Take the second one with 25mcd

 

Some days ago I replied to a (really valid) question from Fairlightiii:

 

I'm a bit unsure if the mcd value specified by Reichelt is the correct one.
E.g. in the catalog the low-cost LEDs are specified with 8-32 mcd, but at the website the red one with 2,5 mcd
The standard LEDs are specified with 1,3 - 5 mcd, and at the website the red one with 1,3 mcd

Really confusing... so, is it a typo, and actually the low-cost LED has around 25 mcd?

 

So - recommended value is now 10 or higher - and if they are 25 mcd, then even better! :)

 

Best Regards, Thorsten.

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thanx for your reply T.K....

okay then the choice is much easier for me, cause then i only order the red one with 25mcd and take the 2x5 with 3,7mcd out of my orderlist. that saves a little money...i red the build guide for the MB6582 written by hawkeye...he wrote something about the encoders and as you can see i have documented some problems with the bours encoder here in that thread. so i decided to take hawkeyes prefered encoders onto my orderlist and they are realy much expensiver and an order of 120 pieces is a lot of money. :-) ther it is good to save money at the LEDs side! :-)

 

 

Regards and Thanx again for your help!

Matthias

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Wonder if I dare order 130 of those Bourns encoders, or if I should look at importing 100 plus Soundwell encoders with switch myself? The 16mm ALPS encoders are obsolete, there is some remaining stock, but none with a switch as far as I can tell.

 

If I had the time it would be interesting to evaluate a few different encoders and set up a bulk. Then again, getting the whole load from Mouser is convenient.

 

Also, looking at 2x5mm LEDs at Mouser, there seem to be a lot of choice around 5 and 8mcd. There's also an 80mcd red model I guess you could use if you employ serious resistors (1k or more). Hmm...

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